| Author |
Message |
Pete
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:09 am
Post subject: Correct or not |
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New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
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Maria Conlon
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:09 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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Pete wrote:
| Quote: | New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"?
|
In American English (AmE), "surgery" is correct.
Because using "surgery" is idiomatic in that instance in the US. The
usage in British English (BrE) may differ.
Maria Conlon
Just bring on the Vicodin... |
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Mark Brader
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:09 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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"Pete":
| Quote: | New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
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Correct as it stands.
| Quote: | Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
|
We just had a thread on "surgery" used like this as a count noun.
It's common in North American medical usage. Some other people
accept it, some don't.
However, in this case the mass noun conveys the sense better; it's
pain following surgery in general, rather than a specific instance.
So stay with the original.
--
Mark Brader | "We didn't just track down that bug,
Toronto | we left evidence of its extermination
msb@vex.net | as a warning to other bugs" --Dan Lyke
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Steve Hayes
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 12:16 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:25:44 GMT, Pete <Pete@how.com> wrote:
| Quote: | New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
|
Not.
A surgery is a place where doctors consult patients and polticians consult
constituents. Surgeries likewise, just more of them.
And it should be "medication", not "medications".
Medication is a cocktail of several different medicines prescribed for a
particular ailment.
"Medications" would mean several cocktails or regimens prescribed for several
different ailments.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk |
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The Other Fran
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 12:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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Steve Hayes wrote:
| Quote: | On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:25:44 GMT, Pete <Pete@how.com> wrote:
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
Not.
A surgery is a place where doctors consult patients and polticians consult
constituents. Surgeries likewise, just more of them.
And it should be "medication", not "medications".
Medication is a cocktail of several different medicines prescribed for a
particular ailment.
"Medications" would mean several cocktails or regimens prescribed for several
different ailments.
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I disagree. In some cases, "medication" and "medications" can be used
interchangeably.
e.g.
Doctor: "Is your son currently taking any medication for the
condition?"
Parent: "Oh yes, he's taking a number of medications to relieve the
symptoms."
OR
Parent: "Oh yes, he's yes taking medication to relieve the symptoms."
In the above quote from the OP,
||||
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
||||
The word "medications" is perfectly unremarkable here, though I might
subsitute "have helped to" or "can help to" or "could help to" or "will
help to" (depending on the sense) for "help" there. It's clear that the
person is discussing a number of different preparations.
The word "medication" should be used whenever speaking generically.
e.g.
"Have you taken your medication this morning?" [which could refer to
one or more drugs or preparations known to the speaker]
"I believe he's on medication for the ADHD." [a non-specific reference]
TOF |
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Jim Lawton
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 2:12 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:34:21 GMT, "Maria Conlon" <maria.c-b@sbcglobal.net>
wrote:
| Quote: | Pete wrote:
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"?
In American English (AmE), "surgery" is correct.
....If not, why?
Because using "surgery" is idiomatic in that instance in the US. The
usage in British English (BrE) may differ.
|
No, it's the same. The only way in which I would change this sentence is to
insert the "to" before "alleviate".
--
Jim
the polymoth |
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Ross Howard
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 2:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:12:51 GMT, Jim Lawton
<usenet1@jimlawton.TAKEOUTinfo> wrought:
| Quote: | On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:34:21 GMT, "Maria Conlon" <maria.c-b@sbcglobal.net
wrote:
Pete wrote:
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"?
In American English (AmE), "surgery" is correct.
....If not, why?
Because using "surgery" is idiomatic in that instance in the US. The
usage in British English (BrE) may differ.
No, it's the same. The only way in which I would change this sentence is to
insert the "to" before "alleviate".
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Help's "to" has been in intensive care for decades in BrE too. (Do
Tunes help you *to* breathe more easily?)
--
Ross Howard |
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Salvatore Volatile
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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Pete wrote:
| Quote: | New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
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If you are speaking idiomatic AmE, it should not be either "a surgery" or
"surgeries", because "surgery" is not countable. An exception exists in
some occupational jargons, such as, apparently, that associated with the
medical equipment sales field. |
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Default User
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:44 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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Steve Hayes wrote:
| Quote: | And it should be "medication", not "medications".
Medication is a cocktail of several different medicines prescribed
for a particular ailment.
"Medications" would mean several cocktails or regimens prescribed for
several different ailments.
|
How exactly do you know that this is not the case? Not all surgeries
are the same, likely different techniques and medications will be
appropriate for different types of surgery.
I like it as it stands.
Brian
--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com) |
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Charles Riggs
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 7:08 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:26:00 +0000 (UTC), Salvatore Volatile
<me@privacy.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Pete wrote:
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
If you are speaking idiomatic AmE, it should not be either "a surgery" or
"surgeries", because "surgery" is not countable. An exception exists in
some occupational jargons, such as, apparently, that associated with the
medical equipment sales field.
Several people here, in addition to our salesman friend, seem to be |
confusing "surgery" with"operation". In the British Isles, two
surgeries refers to two doctor's offices; in the US, the word
generally isn't countable in any context.
--
Charles Riggs |
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Steve Hayes
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 7:08 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On 27 Oct 2005 17:44:36 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuserbr@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Steve Hayes wrote:
And it should be "medication", not "medications".
Medication is a cocktail of several different medicines prescribed
for a particular ailment.
"Medications" would mean several cocktails or regimens prescribed for
several different ailments.
How exactly do you know that this is not the case? Not all surgeries
are the same, likely different techniques and medications will be
appropriate for different types of surgery.
I like it as it stands.
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Well I suppose some might say the people who voted for the MP for Cheltenham
South need their heads read, so if they attend his surgery medication might be
appropriate.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk |
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Peter Duncanson
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2005 12:41 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 04:42:18 +0100, Charles Riggs <chriggs@éircom.net>
wrote:
| Quote: | On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:26:00 +0000 (UTC), Salvatore Volatile
me@privacy.net> wrote:
Pete wrote:
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
If you are speaking idiomatic AmE, it should not be either "a surgery" or
"surgeries", because "surgery" is not countable. An exception exists in
some occupational jargons, such as, apparently, that associated with the
medical equipment sales field.
Several people here, in addition to our salesman friend, seem to be
confusing "surgery" with"operation". In the British Isles, two
surgeries refers to two doctor's offices; in the US, the word
generally isn't countable in any context.
|
Perhaps I'm missing the point here. In the UK one of the meanings of
surgery is what is done by a surgeon during an operation. Many
operations will start with the administration of an anaesthetic, which I
assume is not considered to be "surgery".
--
Peter Duncanson
UK (posting from a.u.e) |
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Default User
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2005 1:09 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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Steve Hayes wrote:
| Quote: | On 27 Oct 2005 17:44:36 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuserbr@yahoo.com
wrote:
Steve Hayes wrote:
And it should be "medication", not "medications".
Medication is a cocktail of several different medicines prescribed
for a particular ailment.
"Medications" would mean several cocktails or regimens prescribed
for >> several different ailments.
How exactly do you know that this is not the case? Not all surgeries
are the same, likely different techniques and medications will be
appropriate for different types of surgery.
I like it as it stands.
Well I suppose some might say the people who voted for the MP for
Cheltenham South need their heads read, so if they attend his surgery
medication might be appropriate.
|
Rather than answer the point, you reply with some sort of supposed
analogy that doesn't fit. Well done.
I stand by what I said, if you want to specifically address that I'll
respond.
Brian
--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com) |
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Steve Hayes
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2005 7:07 am
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On 28 Oct 2005 19:09:49 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuserbr@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Steve Hayes wrote:
On 27 Oct 2005 17:44:36 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuserbr@yahoo.com
wrote:
Steve Hayes wrote:
And it should be "medication", not "medications".
Medication is a cocktail of several different medicines prescribed
for a particular ailment.
"Medications" would mean several cocktails or regimens prescribed
for >> several different ailments.
How exactly do you know that this is not the case? Not all surgeries
are the same, likely different techniques and medications will be
appropriate for different types of surgery.
I like it as it stands.
Well I suppose some might say the people who voted for the MP for
Cheltenham South need their heads read, so if they attend his surgery
medication might be appropriate.
Rather than answer the point, you reply with some sort of supposed
analogy that doesn't fit. Well done.
I stand by what I said, if you want to specifically address that I'll
respond.
|
Well since you ignored the point I made in my original post, I suppose we are
destined to talk past each other without communicating, so there's no more to
be said.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk |
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Charles Riggs
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2005 12:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Correct or not |
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On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 19:41:14 +0100, Peter Duncanson
<mail@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
| Quote: | On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 04:42:18 +0100, Charles Riggs <chriggs@éircom.net
wrote:
On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:26:00 +0000 (UTC), Salvatore Volatile
me@privacy.net> wrote:
Pete wrote:
New techniques and medications help alleviate patients' pain following
surgery.
Should it be either "a surgery" or "surgeries"? If not, why?
If you are speaking idiomatic AmE, it should not be either "a surgery" or
"surgeries", because "surgery" is not countable. An exception exists in
some occupational jargons, such as, apparently, that associated with the
medical equipment sales field.
Several people here, in addition to our salesman friend, seem to be
confusing "surgery" with"operation". In the British Isles, two
surgeries refers to two doctor's offices; in the US, the word
generally isn't countable in any context.
Perhaps I'm missing the point here. In the UK one of the meanings of
surgery is what is done by a surgeon during an operation.
|
Yes. The same is true in the US.
| Quote: | Many
operations will start with the administration of an anaesthetic, which I
assume is not considered to be "surgery".
|
I wonder if it falls under the category of what doctors are now
calling procedures. When I had my kidney stones removed, they referred
to it as a "procedure". It seemed much like an operation from my
standpoint, and I said so, but they insisted their terminology was the
usual one.
--
Charles Riggs |
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