danish origin in danish pastry
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danish origin in danish pastry
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retrosorter
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Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:13 pm    Post subject: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

What is the Danish origin in "Danish pastry"? I see where "Danish
pastry" was discussed here previosly, but I didn't see where the Danish
origin was addressed. I remember being in Denmark and hearing these
pastries called "vienerbrod" which I assume refers to the Viennese
origins of the pastries. Any ideas, also, when the term ""Danish
pastry" is first recoded in English? Thanks
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Don Phillipson
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Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:48 pm    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

"retrosorter" <hrichler@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:1130429603.739669.257970@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

Quote:
What is the Danish origin in "Danish pastry"? . . . [or] when the term
""Danish
pastry" is first recoded in English? Thanks

Danish Pastry was in the 1950s an Americanism i.e. not used
in Britain (whatever was on the table.) Naming food for its
supposed origins is common, cf. hamburger, wiener, French fries etc.
One of the reasons may be that cooks for centuries apparently
traveled much more than other craftsmen i.e. often found
receptive palates overseas for recipes from home.

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
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retrosorter
Guest





Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:00 pm    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

But did any of these confections particularly indigenous to Denmark?
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Christian Weisgerber
Guest





Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:57 pm    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

retrosorter <hrichler@sympatico.ca> wrote:

Quote:
But did any of these confections particularly indigenous to Denmark?

The Danish exchange students I met in the US were quite surprised
by the term and denied any actual Danish connection.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de
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Skitt
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 1:40 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

Don Phillipson wrote:
Quote:
"retrosorter" wrote:

What is the Danish origin in "Danish pastry"? . . . [or] when the
term ""Danish pastry" is first recoded in English? Thanks

Danish Pastry was in the 1950s an Americanism i.e. not used
in Britain (whatever was on the table.) Naming food for its
supposed origins is common, cf. hamburger, wiener, French fries etc.
One of the reasons may be that cooks for centuries apparently
traveled much more than other craftsmen i.e. often found
receptive palates overseas for recipes from home.

MWCD10 dates "Danish pastry" at 1928. It does not mention its etymology.

I tasted the "real thing" in Greenland, in 1957, baked by Danish engineers
working at the Thule AB Service Club. Delish!
--
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/
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Raymond S. Wise
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 1:50 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

Skitt wrote:
Quote:
Don Phillipson wrote:
"retrosorter" wrote:

What is the Danish origin in "Danish pastry"? . . . [or] when the
term ""Danish pastry" is first recoded in English? Thanks

Danish Pastry was in the 1950s an Americanism i.e. not used
in Britain (whatever was on the table.) Naming food for its
supposed origins is common, cf. hamburger, wiener, French fries etc.
One of the reasons may be that cooks for centuries apparently
traveled much more than other craftsmen i.e. often found
receptive palates overseas for recipes from home.

MWCD10 dates "Danish pastry" at 1928. It does not mention its etymology.

I tasted the "real thing" in Greenland, in 1957, baked by Danish engineers
working at the Thule AB Service Club. Delish!


MWCD11 online pushes the date back to 1921.


--
Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA

E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
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Donna Richoux
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 2:16 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

retrosorter <hrichler@sympatico.ca> wrote:

Quote:
But did any of these confections particularly indigenous to Denmark?

I noticed that the instructions at Google say you can type in a
question, the way "Ask Jeeves" tried to work. So I tried it just now:

do danes make danish pastry

And the first several hits discuss the variety of pastries the Danes
make, and how they are superior (apparently) to the mild form that the
Americans call "Danish pastry." I suggest you check them out for
yourself.

But - indigenous? That's really tough, for food -- we rarely know
exactly where and how long ago a dish or cooking style began.

In fact, there's just the kind of circular reference in the nomenclature
we've seen with frankfurters (Frankfurt) and wieners (Wien or Vienna).
One of those articles says:

the yeast-risen puff pastry is called Kopenhagener
Geback, literally "Copenhagen bread," in Austria ...
Ironically, the yeast-risen pastries are still
called wienerbrød, or Vienna bread, in Denmark.

My guess is the Danes learned it from the Viennese, long ago.

Here's a variety of pictures of wienerbrød:

http://images.google.com/images?q=wienerbr%F8d&ie=ISO-8859-1&hl=en&btnG=
Search+Images

In case that doesn't work, it is wienerbrød pasted into Google Images.

--
Best -- Donna Richoux
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Ted Schuerzinger
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 2:22 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

Somebody claiming to be "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipson@ttrryytteell.com>
wrote in news:Ly78f.419$XR4.1463@newscontent-01.sprint.ca:

Quote:
Naming food for its
supposed origins is common, cf. hamburger, wiener, French fries etc.

Surely you know that french fries are so named because the potatoes are
frenched before cooking, and has little to do with France!

--
Ted <fedya at bestweb dot net>
Oh Marge, anyone can miss Canada, all tucked away down there....
--Homer Simpson
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Default User
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 3:44 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

Ted Schuerzinger wrote:

Quote:
Somebody claiming to be "Don Phillipson"
d.phillipson@ttrryytteell.com> wrote in
news:Ly78f.419$XR4.1463@newscontent-01.sprint.ca:

Naming food for its
supposed origins is common, cf. hamburger, wiener, French fries etc.

Surely you know that french fries are so named because the potatoes
are frenched before cooking, and has little to do with France!

No, nor do you. The etymology of the term is in dispute.


Brian

--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)
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Bertel Lund Hansen
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 4:11 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

retrosorter skrev:

Quote:
What is the Danish origin in "Danish pastry"?

I am not sure. It is true that we call it "wienerbrød", and we
think of Wien if we focus on the word, but in German-speaking
countries it is known as "ein Copenhagener", which I doubt they
would call it if they invented it. I don't think anybody knows
who (first?) invented it.

Bertel
Denmark
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Bertel Lund Hansen
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 4:57 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

retrosorter skrev:

Quote:
But did any of these confections particularly indigenous to Denmark?

I do not know, but every baker has several sorts of wienerbrød
every day, and everybody knows it. It has been so ever since I
was a child. Many people eat it every day. At two workingplaces
where I have been, small groups would form and agree to have
wienerbrød each day, the duty of supplying it going round robin.

PS. My sending you an e-mail was an error.

--
Bertel
Denmark
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Bertel Lund Hansen
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 6:02 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

Christian Weisgerber skrev:

Quote:
The Danish exchange students I met in the US were quite surprised
by the term and denied any actual Danish connection.

There must have been some misunderstanding then. It is impossible
to live in Denmark and not know wienerbrød, but maybe the
american specimens that they saw, were not quite like the Danish
sort?

--
Bertel
Denmark
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Charles Riggs
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 7:08 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

On 27 Oct 2005 21:44:57 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuserbr@yahoo.com>
wrote:

Quote:
Ted Schuerzinger wrote:

Somebody claiming to be "Don Phillipson"
d.phillipson@ttrryytteell.com> wrote in
news:Ly78f.419$XR4.1463@newscontent-01.sprint.ca:

Naming food for its
supposed origins is common, cf. hamburger, wiener, French fries etc.

Surely you know that french fries are so named because the potatoes
are frenched before cooking, and has little to do with France!

No, nor do you.

Oy!
--
Charles Riggs
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Jukka Aho
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 7:08 am    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:

Quote:
It is true that we call it "wienerbrød" [in Denmark], and we
think of Wien if we focus on the word, but in German-speaking
countries it is known as "ein Copenhagener", which I doubt they
would call it if they invented it. I don't think anybody knows
who (first?) invented it.

Just for the record, the Finnish name for it ("viineri") is a reference
to Vienna as well.

--
znark
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Pat Durkin
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 10:26 pm    Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry Reply with quote

"Bertel Lund Hansen" <nospamfilius@lundhansen.dk> wrote in message
news:wmduexrcatk8.mdyms4i52v5c.dlg@40tude.net...
Quote:
retrosorter skrev:

What is the Danish origin in "Danish pastry"?

I am not sure. It is true that we call it "wienerbrød", and we
think of Wien if we focus on the word, but in German-speaking
countries it is known as "ein Copenhagener", which I doubt they
would call it if they invented it. I don't think anybody knows
who (first?) invented it.

Have you heard of "kringles" in Denmark?

On one of the sites I found, the wienerbrod was the straight stick
version of the normally pretzel-shaped or circular kringle. On another
site, the Sons of Norway were celebrating the kringle, though I am
sorry, I didn't keep spelling. It began with "fodsel---" and went on
forever with strange letters.

I know some people think of the Danish pastry as an individual baked
spiral roll with some kind of cheese filling, but I always think of the
kringle first. I wasn't able to find a site that dated the term, or
that separated the pastry from Santa Clause/Kris Kringle. But many
recipes never mention the kringle as a seasonal delicacy.
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