| Author |
Message |
Murray Arnow
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 11:48 pm
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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Maria Conlon wrote:
| Quote: |
Oh, yes. It all comes back now.
But I didn't order root beer. I don't, and never did, like root beer. In
A&W, I think I always ordered a foot-long and an orange drink. (Is that
what they had? Orange?)
|
I, too! I never liked root beer, except maybe in a root beer float. Which
brings up the rather dull question, why does "root beer" eschew the hyphen
even when used as a compound modifier? ("High school" shares the same disdain
for the hyphen.)
More importantly, what's become of the foot-longs? I don't see them anymore.
They were certainly a sought-after treat. I don't know why the length of a
tube steak affected its taste, but it certainly did.
--
Just checking to see if my server is accepting posts
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Maria Conlon
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:53 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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Murray Arnow wrote:
| Quote: | Maria Conlon wrote:
Oh, yes. It all comes back now.
But I didn't order root beer. I don't, and never did, like root
beer. In A&W, I think I always ordered a foot-long and an orange
drink. (Is that what they had? Orange?)
I, too! I never liked root beer, except maybe in a root beer float.
Which brings up the rather dull question, why does "root beer" eschew
the hyphen even when used as a compound modifier? ("High school"
shares the same disdain for the hyphen.)
|
We could change things, maybe, by uneschewing the hyphen and thereby
influencing the world. No?
| Quote: | More importantly, what's become of the foot-longs? I don't see them
anymore. They were certainly a sought-after treat. I don't know why
the length of a tube steak affected its taste, but it certainly did.
|
Oh, dear. You've brought on an episode of awareness of my forgetfulness.
I just saw foot-longs for sale somewhere, but I can't remember where. I
can't even remember which state they were in. (By that, I don't mean
physical state -- such as raw, cooked, past-their-prime, etc. I mean US
state: Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky, or Tennessee.)
Anyway, foot-longs *are* better than their shorter brothers. (Why not
"sisters"? I leave that for contemplation, but not necessarily for
discussion. [And I say that the obvious answer isn't correct.])
Speaking of hot dogs, have you noticed that our Resident Expert, Areff,
has returned to the From column?
--
Maria Conlon |
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Ted Schuerzinger
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 3:56 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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Somebody claiming to be Evan Kirshenbaum <kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com> wrote in
news:fyqed9rb.fsf@hpl.hp.com:
| Quote: | Also "Turkeyburg" and "Veggieburg".
When I studied linguistics a couple of decades ago, we called these
"burger morphs". Besides "-burger", there are "-dog" (from "hot
dog"), "-gate" (from "Watergate", the name of the hotel connected with
Nixon's scandal), "-holic" (from "alcoholic"), "-rama", (from
"panarama"), "-athon" (from "marathon"), "Mc-" (from "McDonalds"),
"rent-a-" (from "rent-a-car"), "-bot" (from "robot"), and probably
others.
|
% Soon enough, OFF are at the parking lot of the Knowledgeum.
Lisa: What a whimsical building. Who says science can't be fun?
Bart: Me. I smell a museum.
Homer: Yeah, good things don't end with -eum. They end with -mania, or
-teria!
<http://www.snpp.com/episodes/5F13>
--
Ted <fedya at bestweb dot net>
Oh Marge, anyone can miss Canada, all tucked away down there....
--Homer Simpson
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Sara Lorimer
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 5:21 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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Maria Conlon <maria.c-b@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Oh, dear. You've brought on an episode of awareness of my forgetfulness.
I just saw foot-longs for sale somewhere, but I can't remember where. I
can't even remember which state they were in. (By that, I don't mean
physical state -- such as raw, cooked, past-their-prime, etc. I mean US
state: Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky, or Tennessee.)
|
I feel that I've seen them for sale in a baseball stadium, most likely
in Seattle or New York. The last time I saw one in a restaurant was in
1988, near Harvard Square (Pizzaria Uno's, as I recall). It was the last
hotdog I ate for thirteen years, so I remember it.
--
SML |
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Robert Bannister
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:51 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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|
Skitt wrote:
| Quote: | Robert Bannister wrote:
Pat Durkin wrote:
"Bertel Lund Hansen" <nospamfilius@lundhansen.dk> wrote in message
news:169e9hlnxg36s$.aauswjlxfe3c$.dlg@40tude.net...
Chris Waigl skrev:
I believe that the English word
for it is "pretzel".
Oops, "Brezel" is for me salty, made from a bread dough, and with a
slick
brown surface created by treating the fully formed but unbaked
thing with
highly concentrated salt water.
We call that "saltkringle".
"Fødselsdagskringle" - "birthday pretzel"? Usually in Denmark we
serve
"lagkage" (layer cake) or "brunsviger" (another speciality that
you may
not know and which you definitely should taste if ever you get the
chance) at a birthday party
Any connection with Braunschweig (Brunswick)?
Yes, that is the name that has become our word, but I do not know
how or why. I suppose the brunsviger originated there, but I
don't know.
But here in US (or at least Wisconsin) Braunschweiger is a kind of
liver sausage. I wouldn't dream of associating it with pastries and
other delights.
Not that liver sausage is anything but a delight, mind you.
For the longest time I simply assumed Braun (brown) was the color of
the smoked liver sausage, which I thought of as "schweiger". Thus, a
particular kind of liver sausage.
Either way, great on rye bread with raw onions.
For me, "Braunschweiger" is a largish, soft sausage in the salami
family; a bit like very fresh Mettwurst.
Braunschweiger:
http://www.koenemannsausage.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_Id=97
Mettwurst:
http://www.koenemannsausage.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_Id=134
Salami:
http://www.koenemannsausage.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_Id=140
Here's some Blutwurst:
http://www.koenemannsausage.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_Id=103
Took me a while to find a picture. Most sites just give a description, |
like this one:
http://www.cma.de/genuss_57274.php#1
This picture does not do it justice, in my opinion, as I'm used to much
larger, redder ones:
http://webs.uvigo.es/sli/xermanismos/Glosario/Glosario%20dividido%20para%20consulta%20tematica/Gastronomia%20(Comida%20e%20bebida).htm
--
Rob Bannister |
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Robert Bannister
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:57 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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|
Donna Richoux wrote:
| Quote: | Right. I have no way of knowing if the people who live in that region
(outside the city) still use it for identification. Perhaps you know.
Well, I think what is pertinent to the discussion is that when it comes
to food names, historical names for regions that don't officially exist
any more still count, because they meant something at the time. I forget
which English counties have been re-drawn out of existence, but I bet
some gave their names to cheeses or other famous associations.
M-W dates the food term "Braunschweiger" to 1934.
Here's a better picture: |
http://www.braunschweiger.de/sortiment/Brsg_Mettwurst_Knob.html
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be a
liver sausage in America is a mystery.
--
Rob Bannister |
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Skitt
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:07 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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|
Robert Bannister wrote:
| Quote: | Donna Richoux wrote:
Right. I have no way of knowing if the people who live in that region
(outside the city) still use it for identification. Perhaps you know.
Well, I think what is pertinent to the discussion is that when it
comes to food names, historical names for regions that don't
officially exist any more still count, because they meant something
at the time. I forget which English counties have been re-drawn out
of existence, but I bet some gave their names to cheeses or other
famous associations. M-W dates the food term "Braunschweiger" to 1934.
Here's a better picture:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/sortiment/Brsg_Mettwurst_Knob.html
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be
a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
|
Yeah, well, the sausage in the picture is just Mettwurst. It happens to be
one of the many products made by a company in Braunschweig.
See the rest of the Braunschweiger sausages at:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/ and click on
Braunschweiger Sortiment
--
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/ |
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John Holmes
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 4:40 pm
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
|
|
Mike Lyle wrote:
| Quote: | John Holmes wrote:
Mike Lyle wrote:
[...]
Some at least of the Celts had a horse-goddess, Epona. I'm
occasionally tempted by the notion that this may have something to
do with the reluctance of the British to eat horse-flesh (I don't
think this is an original idea).
Isn't the fairground hobby-horse descended from something like that?
Fairground hobby-horse? maybe I call it something else. But you see a
bloke wearing a horse's head trotting round Morris dancers or similar
pagan merrymakers.
|
That's the one. They seem to be mainly associated with May fairs, but
often got an outing for other local festivities such as Christmas and St
George's Day:
http://www.england-in-particular.info/horsobby.html
http://www.conjure.com/TRINE/hobbyhrs.html
The first page, despite the domain name, says:
The horse mask is played out in the spring not only in a few corners
of England but, as Violet Alford found, in Austria, the Czech Republic,
France, Poland, Slovakia and Switzerland everywhere flaunting his
passion for young women ...
See also the horse called Hob-Nob, associated with the Salisbury giant:
http://www.wiltshire.gov.uk/community/getfaq.php?id=273
There was also a character named "Hobby Horse" in some old plays.
http://www.shef.ac.uk/uni/projects/tdrg/Texts/CastIndexH.htm
Cum in cum in thou hobby hors
and bring thy ould fol at thy arse
sing tanter a day sing tanter a day
sing heigh down down with a derry doun a
- Revesby, 1779, play about Morris dances
--
Regards
John
for mail: my initials plus a u e
at tpg dot com dot au |
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Donna Richoux
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 5:00 pm
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
|
|
Skitt <skitt99@comcast.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Robert Bannister wrote:
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be
a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
Yeah, well, the sausage in the picture is just Mettwurst. It happens to be
one of the many products made by a company in Braunschweig.
See the rest of the Braunschweiger sausages at:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/ and click on
Braunschweiger Sortiment
|
Do you think any of those in that picture is the kind of
nearly-spreadable "Braunschweiger" in the US? Maybe the "Echtes Hartmann
Würstchenschmalz"? Although since that comes in a tub, it looks too
soft.
The US co. Hormel has definitions and pix of liver sausage and
Braunschweiger here:
http://www.hormel.com/kitchen/glossary.asp?id=33408&catitemid=
I can buy something just like Braunschweiger here in the Netherlands,
but I forget what it's called on the package.
--
Best -- Donna Richoux |
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Skitt
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:58 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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|
Donna Richoux wrote:
| Quote: | Skitt wrote:
Robert Bannister wrote:
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to
be a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
Yeah, well, the sausage in the picture is just Mettwurst. It
happens to be one of the many products made by a company in
Braunschweig.
See the rest of the Braunschweiger sausages at:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/ and click on
Braunschweiger Sortiment
Do you think any of those in that picture is the kind of
nearly-spreadable "Braunschweiger" in the US? Maybe the "Echtes
Hartmann Würstchenschmalz"? Although since that comes in a tub, it
looks too soft.
|
I don't know.
I see there what the Germans call Leberwurst and then the other, and I don't
know what exactly the other is in German parlance.
| Quote: | I can buy something just like Braunschweiger here in the Netherlands,
but I forget what it's called on the package.
-- |
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/ |
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Pat Durkin
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 3:03 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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|
"Robert Bannister" <robban@it.net.au> wrote in message
news:3svq4kFqc5vkU1@individual.net...
| Quote: | Donna Richoux wrote:
Right. I have no way of knowing if the people who live in that region
(outside the city) still use it for identification. Perhaps you know.
Well, I think what is pertinent to the discussion is that when it
comes
to food names, historical names for regions that don't officially
exist
any more still count, because they meant something at the time. I
forget
which English counties have been re-drawn out of existence, but I bet
some gave their names to cheeses or other famous associations.
M-W dates the food term "Braunschweiger" to 1934.
Here's a better picture:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/sortiment/Brsg_Mettwurst_Knob.html
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be
a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
|
OK. Mettwurst, as it presented here and in your earlier post with all
the pages, whether it is produced in Braunschweig or not, looks very
like what I call "ring bologna". Bologna has been applied to dozens of
varieties and sizes of sausage, and it is said that our meat under this
name originated in Bologna, It., as "mortadella". In mass production,
bologna most often loses any individual meat characteristics and becomes
a paste, which, cooked and in casings, is quite solid. (Many people
wouldn't eat the stuff if it had large chunks of fat. However, bits of
pistachio and garlic wouldn't go down reluctantly. I think most people
are afraid they will recognize parts of a "friendly" animal.)
American styles of bolona vary according to the grind, some of it being
rather dark red and coarse (my favorite) and others being of the pale
pink "big bologna" variety, a "cold cut", sliced for sandwiches and
roll-ups. It has the general reputation of containing a high proportion
of cereal grain as filler, but I don't know if that is well-earned. Of
course, there is a "beef bologna", just as there are "all-beef franks",
etc.
Thank you for posting this food stuff. I opened it while eating lunch.
Got kind of a rush, truth be told. |
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Pat Durkin
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 3:03 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
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|
"Evan Kirshenbaum" <kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com> wrote in message
news:br12bkar.fsf@hpl.hp.com...
| Quote: | "Pat Durkin" <durk183@sbcglobal.com> writes:
"Evan Kirshenbaum" <kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com> wrote in message
When I studied linguistics a couple of decades ago, we called these
"burger morphs". Besides "-burger", there are "-dog" (from "hot
dog"), "-gate" (from "Watergate", the name of the hotel connected
with
Nixon's scandal), "-holic" (from "alcoholic"), "-rama", (from
"panarama"), "-athon" (from "marathon"), "Mc-" (from "McDonalds"),
"rent-a-" (from "rent-a-car"), "-bot" (from "robot"), and probably
others.
-avan (caravan).
What has that engendered?
|
Can't think of a thing, now. But I think that once, 50 years ago, I
heard it used in some discussion of parade arrangements.
> |
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Robert Bannister
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:21 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
|
|
Skitt wrote:
| Quote: | Robert Bannister wrote:
Donna Richoux wrote:
Right. I have no way of knowing if the people who live in that region
(outside the city) still use it for identification. Perhaps you know.
Well, I think what is pertinent to the discussion is that when it
comes to food names, historical names for regions that don't
officially exist any more still count, because they meant something
at the time. I forget which English counties have been re-drawn out
of existence, but I bet some gave their names to cheeses or other
famous associations. M-W dates the food term "Braunschweiger" to 1934.
Here's a better picture:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/sortiment/Brsg_Mettwurst_Knob.html
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be
a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
Yeah, well, the sausage in the picture is just Mettwurst. It happens to
be one of the many products made by a company in Braunschweig.
See the rest of the Braunschweiger sausages at:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/ and click on
Braunschweiger Sortiment
That made me feel quite hungry. I note a distinct absence of |
Braunschweiger Leberwurst.
--
Rob Bannister |
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Robert Bannister
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:23 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
|
|
Donna Richoux wrote:
| Quote: | Skitt <skitt99@comcast.net> wrote:
Robert Bannister wrote:
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be
a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
Yeah, well, the sausage in the picture is just Mettwurst. It happens to be
one of the many products made by a company in Braunschweig.
See the rest of the Braunschweiger sausages at:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/ and click on
Braunschweiger Sortiment
Do you think any of those in that picture is the kind of
nearly-spreadable "Braunschweiger" in the US? Maybe the "Echtes Hartmann
Würstchenschmalz"? Although since that comes in a tub, it looks too
soft.
|
Schmalz is like dripping. I'm guessing this a specially flavoured pork
dripping.
--
Rob Bannister |
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Robert Bannister
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:28 am
Post subject: Re: danish origin in danish pastry |
|
|
Pat Durkin wrote:
| Quote: | "Robert Bannister" <robban@it.net.au> wrote in message
news:3svq4kFqc5vkU1@individual.net...
Donna Richoux wrote:
Right. I have no way of knowing if the people who live in that region
(outside the city) still use it for identification. Perhaps you know.
Well, I think what is pertinent to the discussion is that when it
comes
to food names, historical names for regions that don't officially
exist
any more still count, because they meant something at the time. I
forget
which English counties have been re-drawn out of existence, but I bet
some gave their names to cheeses or other famous associations.
M-W dates the food term "Braunschweiger" to 1934.
Here's a better picture:
http://www.braunschweiger.de/sortiment/Brsg_Mettwurst_Knob.html
On another site, I found the town of Braunschweig offering
Braunschweiger Mettwurst as a souvenir of the town. How it came to be
a liver sausage in America is a mystery.
OK. Mettwurst, as it presented here and in your earlier post with all
the pages, whether it is produced in Braunschweig or not, looks very
like what I call "ring bologna". Bologna has been applied to dozens of
varieties and sizes of sausage, and it is said that our meat under this
name originated in Bologna, It., as "mortadella". In mass production,
bologna most often loses any individual meat characteristics and becomes
a paste, which, cooked and in casings, is quite solid. (Many people
wouldn't eat the stuff if it had large chunks of fat. However, bits of
pistachio and garlic wouldn't go down reluctantly. I think most people
are afraid they will recognize parts of a "friendly" animal.)
|
The main difference between these and what I understand by "bologna", is
that these are "Rohwürste", ie fermented rather than cooked.
To your words "bologna" and "bolona", one could add "boloney" and
"polony" (not sure about the "e") - I suspect there was some mix-up
between sausage from Bologna and Polish sausage at some point.
--
Rob Bannister |
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| |
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