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Agamemnon
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:21 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"Steve Hayes" <hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fmf9l1hi6875acka1q7qk8kt516gc6g8j4@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On 18 Oct 2005 00:04:41 -0700, "qquito" <qquito@hotmail.com> wrote:
Can anyone tell how the word "Euthyphro" in Plato's dialogue thus
titled is pronounced? I am talking about the Euthypro Dilemma recorded
in the dialogue.
Depends.
Would you like the Renaissance German prinunciation of Erasmus, or the
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Erasmus pronounced it like Dutch.
movern
| Quote: | Greek prununciation.
The latter would be something like eff-thi-pro (pro as in "property").
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Ph is the Latin transliteration for F not p.
The modern Greek pronunciation is the same as the ancinet.
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CDB
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:40 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"Agamemnon" <agamemnon@hello.to.NO_SPAM> wrote in message
news:voCdnd617bmcssjeRVnysA@pipex.net...
[...]
| Quote: | The modern Greek pronunciation is the same as the ancinet.
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Funny old Greeks, inventing all those different ways of writing "ee". |
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Agamemnon
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:48 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"CDB" <unbellecd@sprint.ca> wrote in message
news:msa5f.6983$5I2.25266@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
| Quote: |
"Agamemnon" <agamemnon@hello.to.NO_SPAM> wrote in message
news:voCdnd617bmcssjeRVnysA@pipex.net...
[...]
The modern Greek pronunciation is the same as the ancinet.
Funny old Greeks, inventing all those different ways of writing "ee".
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Funny old Canadians, not being able to hear the difference.
http://www.bsw.org/?l=72081&a=Art06.html
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Drexl's GAY Escort Agency
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:51 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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Funny old Cockney Pseudogrik RACIST BASTARDS
Argyros G Argyrou
26 St Michaels rd
Northampton |
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CDB
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 1:43 am
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"Agamemnon" <agamemnon@hello.to.NO_SPAM> wrote in message
news:LpmdnZ9WwuHlqMjeRVnysw@pipex.net...
| Quote: |
"CDB" <unbellecd@sprint.ca> wrote in message
news:msa5f.6983$5I2.25266@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
"Agamemnon" <agamemnon@hello.to.NO_SPAM> wrote in message
news:voCdnd617bmcssjeRVnysA@pipex.net...
[...]
The modern Greek pronunciation is the same as the ancinet.
Funny old Greeks, inventing all those different ways of writing
"ee".
Funny old Canadians, not being able to hear the difference.
http://www.bsw.org/?l=72081&a=Art06.html
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Thank you. An interesting account. I note that the author agrees
with me that there are rather a lot of ways of spelling "ee" (section
153" "...the Greeks gave to several letters the sound of 'I'," and
section 157). He also seems to think there have been sound changes
from time to time (section 160).
I should add that I don't defend the Western academic pronunciation of
ancient Greek on the grounds of phonetic accuracy, particularly with
regard to the vowel sounds; it is hardly possible that any one system
of pronunciation could reproduce the different speech-sounds of a
language with such a long history of continuous use. But I think its
ability to reflect classical Attic and Koine spelling is useful for
scholars who deal almost entirely with the written texts, perhaps
unlike the scholars of Greece who see it, and use it, as an archaic
form of their own language.
I can't believe that there have been no sound changes over the last
two and one-half millennia. I would have to see some reason why Greek
should have been excepted from the common fate of all languages for so
long. I don't expect to convince you either, of course.
Finally, as to "old Canadians": you definitely have the advantage of
us there. Old Greeks there definitely were, but the oldest European
Canadians have only been around for four centuries or so -- barely out
of adolescence, really. |
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Karipidu Marianna
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:08 am
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"qquito" <qquito@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1129619081.928768.75390@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | Hell, All:
Can anyone tell how the word "Euthyphro" in Plato's dialogue thus
titled is pronounced? I am talking about the Euthypro Dilemma recorded
in the dialogue.
Thanks.
--Roland
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The diphthong " Eu " is pronounced as "Ev."
Example:
Greek: Ευημερια= evi meria = prosperity.
But if followed by the consonant theta (=th,
Greek: θ ), it is pronounced as "Ef."
Example:
Greek: Ευθυφρων= Ef thyphron= Ef thyfron.
So, Euthyphron is pronounced as Ef thy fron.
Another example:
Greek: Ευθεια= Ef theia= straight line
or
Ευθανασια= Euthanasia= Ef thanasia=
painless death
Καρυπιδου Μαριαννα |
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Karipidu Marianna
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:08 am
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"Karipidu Marianna" <karipidu@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:qKmdnahITfUPPsjeRVn-rQ@comcast.com...
| Quote: |
"qquito" <qquito@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1129619081.928768.75390@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Hell, All:
Can anyone tell how the word "Euthyphro" in Plato's dialogue thus
titled is pronounced? I am talking about the Euthypro Dilemma recorded
in the dialogue.
Thanks.
--Roland
The diphthong " Eu " is pronounced as "Ev."
Example:
Greek: Ευημερια= evi meria = prosperity.
But if followed by the consonant theta (=th,
Greek: θ ), it is pronounced as "Ef."
Example:
Greek: Ευθυφρων= Ef thyphron= Ef thyfron.
So, Euthyphron is pronounced as Ef thy fron.
Another example:
Greek: Ευθεια= Ef theia= straight line
or
Ευθανασια= Euthanasia= Ef thanasia=
painless death
Καρυπιδου Μαριαννα
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You have to remember this: If the EU is followed
by the consonants
θ= th,
κ= k,
ξ= ks,
π= p,
σ= s,
τ= t,
φ= f,
χ= h,
ψ= ps,
it is pronounced as EF. |
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Praxandros-21
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:08 am
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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EUQUFRWN uV LOXOFRWN
EUQUS --=(STREHT , IN INGKLISS)- OPPOSIT --- LOXOS (SLANTET)
FRWN FRHN ---=(MAHNTET, IN INGKLISS)
PROONAOUNST --- EFQIFRON
EFTHY = STRAIGHT VS SLANDED
FRON = MINDED
WHY DON'T YOU GUYS USE THE GREEK ALPHABET ,... ITS BEEN CONCEIVED TO BE ACRO-PHONIC SINCE ITS INCEPTION
AND HAD NEVER CHANGED.....EVER
TZHHHZAS KKRAAAHS !!!!!!
PRAX-21
"CDB" <unbellecd@sprint.ca> wrote in message news:h%65f.6936$5I2.24927@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
"qquito" <qquito@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1129619081.928768.75390@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | Hell, All:
Can anyone tell how the word "Euthyphro" in Plato's dialogue thus
titled is pronounced? I am talking about the Euthypro Dilemma
recorded
in the dialogue.
|
All the interesting discussion about ancient and modern Greek
pronunciations to one side, I think it's the modern English
pronunciation you want. I suggest "YOUTH-i-fro". I admit I don't
recall ever hearing the name pronounced but, if it's connected with
"euthphron" (right-minded), then, even though the accent in Greek was
placed as you see, the upsilon is short (according to my big _Liddell
and Scott_): which means the word would have gone from Latin into
English with the stress* on the first syllable.
The other possibility is "you-THI-fro", based on taking the Greek
tonal accent as a stress mark. I should think either version would be
accepted without comment. Oh, and the "th" would probably be unvoiced
in the first version, especially by North Americans, and voiced in the
second, as in "this".
_________________
*Note distinction between accent and stress. Ancient Greek was
apparently a language that marked syllables by length and tone more
than by stress. |
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Drexl's GAY Escort Agency
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 3:21 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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MAHNTET = MINDED ?
What kind of PIDJIN grik accent you may have is anyones guess
Sounds HORRIBLE ! |
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JupiterZ
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:43 am
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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Sean GAYson Ruttledge you are a piteously backward barbarian torgul,and
a revolting, irredeemably boring vulgarity to all and sundry.
Drexl's GAY Escort Agency of NYC wrote:
| Quote: | MAHNTET = MINDED ?
What kind of PIDJIN grik accent you may have is anyones guess
Sounds HORRIBLE ! |
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Witziges Rtsel
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 4:51 am
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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| Quote: | All the vowels and consonants have changed their sound in Germanic
languages in the past 2000 years whereas in Greek they have remained
constant so do not consider English as a guide to Greek pronunciation.
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Who told you that? Greek has changed a great deal in that time. |
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Steve Hayes
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:17 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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On 19 Oct 2005 12:43:47 -0700, "JupiterZ" <seammos@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Sean GAYson Ruttledge you are a piteously backward barbarian torgul,and
a revolting, irredeemably boring vulgarity to all and sundry.
|
Well that's certainly not how I pronounce "Euthyphro"
--
Terms and conditions apply.
Steve Hayes
hayesstw@yahoo.com |
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choro-nik
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:58 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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Re Praxandro,
Do you mean it *had* never changed until such and such a date or event?
OR
Do you mean it *has* never changed?
Th na se kanoumen, re Ksidinopaidi? Theleis na sou steilo stafili oi karpouzi, re more mou?
--
choro-nik
*******
"Praxandros-21" <christes00k@optonline.net> wrote in message news:ICi5f.11295$1X1.7735@fe12.lga...
EUQUFRWN uV LOXOFRWN
EUQUS --=(STREHT , IN INGKLISS)- OPPOSIT --- LOXOS (SLANTET)
FRWN FRHN ---=(MAHNTET, IN INGKLISS)
PROONAOUNST --- EFQIFRON
EFTHY = STRAIGHT VS SLANDED
FRON = MINDED
WHY DON'T YOU GUYS USE THE GREEK ALPHABET ,... ITS BEEN CONCEIVED TO BE ACRO-PHONIC SINCE ITS INCEPTION
AND HAD NEVER CHANGED.....EVER
TZHHHZAS KKRAAAHS !!!!!!
PRAX-21
"CDB" <unbellecd@sprint.ca> wrote in message news:h%65f.6936$5I2.24927@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
"qquito" <qquito@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1129619081.928768.75390@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | Hell, All:
Can anyone tell how the word "Euthyphro" in Plato's dialogue thus
titled is pronounced? I am talking about the Euthypro Dilemma
recorded
in the dialogue.
|
All the interesting discussion about ancient and modern Greek
pronunciations to one side, I think it's the modern English
pronunciation you want. I suggest "YOUTH-i-fro". I admit I don't
recall ever hearing the name pronounced but, if it's connected with
"euthphron" (right-minded), then, even though the accent in Greek was
placed as you see, the upsilon is short (according to my big _Liddell
and Scott_): which means the word would have gone from Latin into
English with the stress* on the first syllable.
The other possibility is "you-THI-fro", based on taking the Greek
tonal accent as a stress mark. I should think either version would be
accepted without comment. Oh, and the "th" would probably be unvoiced
in the first version, especially by North Americans, and voiced in the
second, as in "this".
_________________
*Note distinction between accent and stress. Ancient Greek was
apparently a language that marked syllables by length and tone more
than by stress. |
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choro-nik
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 1:12 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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Y is not a f**ckin' F, re Praxandro, re Ksidinopaidi.
In Inglese or English (not Ingliss or don't you have the equivalent if the SH as in SHIT (PARDON!!) it is the equivalent of the letter V at least phonetically if not frenetically.
BTW, let's hear you say Fiss & Tsips....
XiXiXi or HeHeHe in Ingliss!!! Si, si. Mouchas grazias! How did that song so re Ksidinopaidi?
Did it go Mpezame moucho? Much, much moucho, re mouchompexti....
Ma ali8ia? Or was it Mpesame moucho and you took it for "Mpazoume moucho"?
--
choro-nik
*******
"Praxandros-21" <christes00k@optonline.net> wrote in message news:ICi5f.11295$1X1.7735@fe12.lga...
EUQUFRWN uV LOXOFRWN
EUQUS --=(STREHT , IN INGKLISS)- OPPOSIT --- LOXOS (SLANTET)
FRWN FRHN ---=(MAHNTET, IN INGKLISS)
PROONAOUNST --- EFQIFRON
EFTHY = STRAIGHT VS SLANDED
FRON = MINDED
WHY DON'T YOU GUYS USE THE GREEK ALPHABET ,... ITS BEEN CONCEIVED TO BE ACRO-PHONIC SINCE ITS INCEPTION
AND HAD NEVER CHANGED.....EVER
TZHHHZAS KKRAAAHS !!!!!!
PRAX-21
"CDB" <unbellecd@sprint.ca> wrote in message news:h%65f.6936$5I2.24927@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
"qquito" <qquito@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1129619081.928768.75390@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | Hell, All:
Can anyone tell how the word "Euthyphro" in Plato's dialogue thus
titled is pronounced? I am talking about the Euthypro Dilemma
recorded
in the dialogue.
|
All the interesting discussion about ancient and modern Greek
pronunciations to one side, I think it's the modern English
pronunciation you want. I suggest "YOUTH-i-fro". I admit I don't
recall ever hearing the name pronounced but, if it's connected with
"euthphron" (right-minded), then, even though the accent in Greek was
placed as you see, the upsilon is short (according to my big _Liddell
and Scott_): which means the word would have gone from Latin into
English with the stress* on the first syllable.
The other possibility is "you-THI-fro", based on taking the Greek
tonal accent as a stress mark. I should think either version would be
accepted without comment. Oh, and the "th" would probably be unvoiced
in the first version, especially by North Americans, and voiced in the
second, as in "this".
_________________
*Note distinction between accent and stress. Ancient Greek was
apparently a language that marked syllables by length and tone more
than by stress. |
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| Back to top |
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Agamemnon
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 5:33 pm
Post subject: Re: How to Pronounce "Euthyphro"? |
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"Witziges Rtsel" <zer@roer.com> wrote in message
news:4356cdf5@nocnews001.allthesites.org...
| Quote: | All the vowels and consonants have changed their sound in Germanic
languages in the past 2000 years whereas in Greek they have remained
constant so do not consider English as a guide to Greek pronunciation.
Who told you that? Greek has changed a great deal in that time.
|
Who told you that?
Why don't you learn to speak Greek and then you will find out that it is
unpronounceable in any way except the modern pronunciation. That's why is
hasn't changed it sound in over 2000 years. Why don't you also learn Italian
and you will find out that it sounds closer to modern Greek than it does to
German or English. |
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