| Author |
Message |
M. J. Powell
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:35 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
In message <1129504421.708101.260660@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Raymond S. Wise <mplsray@my-deja.com> writes
| Quote: |
M. J. Powell wrote:
In message <1129483250.809904.153350@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
pjdd@rediffmail.com writes
I'm a non-native user of English and I've
just been asked by some friends to settle
an argument. It seems one group says that
the thumb is a finger and the other group
insists that it isn't. It got to the point
where they're making bets and they called
me on the phone to settle it.
In the UK the NHS counts the thumb as a finger. If you go into A & E
with an injury to a little finger it will be recorded as an injury to
Finger No.5
Mike
--
M.J.Powell
When Americans count with their fingers they start with the index
representing 1, middle finger as 2, ring finger as 3, little finger as
4, and finally the thumb as 5.
When the French count with their fingers, they use the thumb for 1,
index for 2, and so forth.
What system do the British ordinarily use? It's clear from your post
that the NHS counts the little finger as 5, but is that true of the
British public?
|
When I count on my fingers, on my right hand, I start with the little
finger and count to five.
I'm left-handed.
Mike
--
M.J.Powell
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Harvey Van Sickle
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:14 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
On 17 Oct 2005, wrote
| Quote: |
rlancashire@hotmail.com wrote:
But if you hold a finger or fingers up to indicate a number to
someone else, the index finger is used for 'one', index and
middle for 'two'... and the thumb isn't used until 'five'.
I know this isn't universal, for example, some cultures use
index-and-thumb for 'two'. I'm not sure if this is what the
original poster meant.
The problem is that I'm not sure what
I meant  There seems to be no doubt
that anatomically the thumb is a finger,
but not in some (and only some) popular
idiomatic usage.
Let's see if it's easier to give an
unequivocal answer if I rephrase the
question : If you were asked how many
fingers a normal human being has, would
you answer "ten" or "eight" ?
|
No question: "ten".
--
Cheers, Harvey
Canadian (30 years) and British (23 years)
For e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:16 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
rlancashire@hotmail.com wrote:
| Quote: |
But if you hold a finger or fingers up to indicate a number to someone
else, the index finger is used for 'one', index and middle for 'two'...
and the thumb isn't used until 'five'.
I know this isn't universal, for example, some cultures use
index-and-thumb for 'two'. I'm not sure if this is what the original
poster meant.
The problem is that I'm not sure what |
I meant There seems to be no doubt
that anatomically the thumb is a finger,
but not in some (and only some) popular
idiomatic usage.
Let's see if it's easier to give an
unequivocal answer if I rephrase the
question : If you were asked how many
fingers a normal human being has, would
you answer "ten" or "eight" ?
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joe Higman
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 4:20 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
----- Original Message -----
From: <pjdd@rediffmail.com>
Newsgroups: alt.english.usage
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2005 6:20 PM
Subject: Is the thumb a finger ?
| Quote: | I've just been asked by some friends to settle
an argument. It seems one group says that
the thumb is a finger and the other group
insists that it isn't.
If one of you native users of English were
asked to settle the argument, which party
would you favour ?
The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had |
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Odysseus
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:04 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
"Raymond S. Wise" wrote:
| Quote: |
M. J. Powell wrote:
|
<snip>
| Quote: |
In the UK the NHS counts the thumb as a finger. If you go into A & E
with an injury to a little finger it will be recorded as an injury to
Finger No.5
When Americans count with their fingers they start with the index
representing 1, middle finger as 2, ring finger as 3, little finger as
4, and finally the thumb as 5.
When the French count with their fingers, they use the thumb for 1,
index for 2, and so forth.
|
FWIW when counting by touching my fingers with the other hand (or
with an object held therein) I start with the thumb, but when
serially extending fingers from the curled position -- or when
signalling to someone -- I extend my thumb last.
| Quote: | What system do the British ordinarily use? It's clear from your post
that the NHS counts the little finger as 5, but is that true of the
British public?
|
I'm in no position to answer your question, but it may be worth
pointing out that the NHS appears to be following the anatomical
convention of numbering digits from the anterior/interior side
backward/outward. (Phalanges are numbered from proximal to distal.)
--
Odysseus |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Odysseus
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:04 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Joe Higman wrote:
| Quote: |
snip
The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
|
Doesn't anyone say "medius" any more? (Or at least write it?)
--
Odysseus |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Isabelle Cecchini
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 2:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Joe Higman a écrit :
[...]
| Quote: | The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know?
|
In French, starting with 1 --thumb: le pouce
2 l'index
3 le médius
4 l'annulaire
5 l'auriculaire
--
Isabelle Cecchini |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 2:57 pm
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Joe Higman wrote:
| Quote: | The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know?
|
I believe "pinkie" comes (like a lot of american words) from the Dutch
word for little finger, "pink". It's the only finger with its own name,
though.
Cheers
Rich |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lanarcam
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 3:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Isabelle Cecchini wrote:
| Quote: | Joe Higman a écrit :
[...]
The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know?
In French, starting with 1 --thumb: le pouce
2 l'index
3 le médius
|
Or "le majeur" ?
| Quote: | 4 l'annulaire
5 l'auriculaire |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
the Omrud
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 4:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Isabelle Cecchini spake thusly:
| Quote: | Joe Higman a écrit :
[...]
The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know?
In French, starting with
|
Aren't these just the same as the English/UK terms, without the word
"finger" at the end?
| Quote: | 1 --thumb: le pouce
2 l'index
|
Index finger
Middle finger
Ring finger
Hmmm. Something to do with the heart? We would ascribe heart-like
feelings to the Ring finger. Unless it's referring to ears.
--
David
=====
replace usenet with the |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CDB
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2005 6:33 pm
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
"the Omrud" <usenet.omrud@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1dc029f89bdb6c5698a16e@news.ntlworld.com...
[...]
| Quote: | 5 l'auriculaire
Hmmm. Something to do with the heart? We would ascribe heart-like
feelings to the Ring finger. Unless it's referring to ears.
|
Fingers were made before Qtips. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Isabelle Cecchini
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 2:12 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Lanarcam a écrit :
| Quote: | Isabelle Cecchini wrote:
Joe Higman a écrit :
[...]
The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know?
In French, starting with 1 --thumb: le pouce
2 l'index
3 le médius
Or "le majeur" ?
|
"Le majeur" is indeed a totally valid alternative.
| Quote: |
4 l'annulaire
5 l'auriculaire
|
--
Isabelle Cecchini |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Isabelle Cecchini
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 2:19 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
the Omrud a écrit :
| Quote: | Isabelle Cecchini spake thusly:
Joe Higman a écrit :
[...]
The thumb is a finger - when I was failing to learn to play the piano I had
to do "five-finger exercises" using one hand. In right-pondian the thumb is
the only digit with its own one-word name. In left-pondian what we call the
little finger is often called the "pinkie". In both ponds the others are
desribed by phrases modifying the finger category - ring finger, index
finger, middle finger. I wonder if there are languages which have single
word names for the other fingers.
Does anyone know?
In French, starting with
Aren't these just the same as the English/UK terms, without the word
"finger" at the end?
|
Yes, those words started their lives as adjectives in French but they
have now reached noun status, which is why I think they qualify as
"single word names" for fingers.
| Quote: |
1 --thumb: le pouce
2 l'index
Index finger
3 le médius
Middle finger
4 l'annulaire
Ring finger
5 l'auriculaire
Hmmm. Something to do with the heart? We would ascribe heart-like
feelings to the Ring finger. Unless it's referring to ears.
|
Ears it is. One physician I'm acquainted with thinks that Q-tips are the
tools of the devil and has made it his personal mission in life to teach
his patients not to use anything smaller than the pinkie finger to clean
their ears. His collection of stories about infected ears and perforated
eardrums is truly horrifying.
--
Isabelle Cecchini |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mike Lyle
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:02 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
Isabelle Cecchini wrote:
| Quote: | the Omrud a écrit :
[...]
5 l'auriculaire
Hmmm. Something to do with the heart? We would ascribe
heart-like
feelings to the Ring finger. Unless it's referring to ears.
Ears it is. One physician I'm acquainted with thinks that Q-tips
are
the tools of the devil and has made it his personal mission in life
to teach his patients not to use anything smaller than the pinkie
finger to clean their ears. His collection of stories about
infected
ears and perforated eardrums is truly horrifying.
|
Anglo doctors say "Never put anything smaller than your elbow in your
ear."
--
Mike. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pat Durkin
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:25 am
Post subject: Re: Is the thumb a finger ? |
|
|
"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3rnqkkFklchaU1@individual.net...
| Quote: | Isabelle Cecchini wrote:
the Omrud a écrit :
[...]
5 l'auriculaire
Hmmm. Something to do with the heart? We would ascribe
heart-like
feelings to the Ring finger. Unless it's referring to ears.
Ears it is. One physician I'm acquainted with thinks that Q-tips
are
the tools of the devil and has made it his personal mission in life
to teach his patients not to use anything smaller than the pinkie
finger to clean their ears. His collection of stories about
infected
ears and perforated eardrums is truly horrifying.
Anglo doctors say "Never put anything smaller than your elbow in your
ear."
|
Right. And no matter how hard I tried, I never managed it. I worry less
about punctured eardrums nowadays, what with all the noise the kids are
downloading and pushing through their headsets. And car speakers! Enough
to concuss one, let alone burst the eardrums. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| |
FAQ
Memberlist
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in