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John Dean
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 6:15 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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James Silverton wrote:
| Quote: | John wrote on Sat, 17 Sep 2005 23:46:22 +0100:
Thomas Easterling wrote:
Long-time lurker, first-time poster, etc... Welcome. Now don't
leave it so long next time ...
I'm in the middle of a, ummm, 'heated debate' about the
verb "to way" as applied to ships.
"weigh" as a verb, however, has a considerable nautical
pedigree. c. absol. = to weigh anchor. Hence, to sail
(from, out of a port, etc.).
So mayhap your "someone" has seen phrases like "we weighed
from Limehouse" and assumed it would be OK to insert "the
ship" after "weighed". It isn't, but we can't prove that.
There's also a specialist meaning:
So "someone" might actually have seen or heard a phrase
somewhere "the crew weighed the ship" (and, if written,
perhaps with a variant/ antiquated spelling of "weighed")
and assumed it had something to do with being under way
when it really had to do with salvage.
Webster's Encyclopedic Dictionary is not one of my favorites but
it lists 13 uses of "weigh". The citation for "to raise" is
indicated as archaic but that meaning would seem to still be in
use in the phrase "to weigh anchor", which is given separately.
Another somewhat different use was "The ship weighed early and
escaped in the fog" so the ship may weigh even if the
intervention of the crew is only implied.
Sure. But the usage, at least in OED, for weighing anchor is "the ship |
weighed" or "we weighed" as in the examples I quoted earlier. There's
nothing in OED to suggest that "we weighed the ship" could possibly be
used to mean "we weighed the anchor".
--
John Dean
Oxford
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ray o'hara
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:01 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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"Thomas Easterling" <zzzthomzzz@talk21.com> wrote in message
news:Xns96D4CB72C9DF7TEeast@216.128.74.13...
| Quote: | Long-time lurker, first-time poster, etc...
I'm in the middle of a, ummm, 'heated debate' about the verb "to way"
as applied to ships.
Someone claims that "The crew ways the ship" is quite standard Navy
terminology to mean that the crew are controlling or driving or piloting
-- or whatever the right word is! -- the ship.
According to him:
In the Navy the term is still very much alive.
That's after finding no mention of "to way" in this context in on-line
dictionaries and CD-ROM dictionaries (the nearest I found was in NSOED
"to way" with three meanings, one being intransitive [thus ruling out
"to way the ship"] and the other two very specialized relating to horses
and wagons; and all of those are marked as "archaic" anyway, so it
hardly supports the "very much alive" claim).
The unfortunate part is that my, um, opponent thinks that merely
saying "I said so, so it must be true" is evidence enough and refuses
to give any verifiable citations for this usage, so I'm wondering if
anyone here can:
1. Confirm the usage (even from personal recollection would be okay to
begin with); and
2. Provide actual evidence more reliable than personal say-so.
Thanks.
--
TE
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It's tough to find something that doesn't exist.. The best you might do is
find make way or make head way which means moving the ship. But way as a
usage for streering id not gonna happen. The crew does not way the ship. |
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ray o'hara
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:01 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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"Tony Cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ig5pi1lef3pasabp9sdtcn1hf14hfdakad@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On 17 Sep 2005 17:30:37 -0400, Thomas Easterling
The aue group has a tendency to focus on the associated bits and
ignore the basic question.
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ARRRGH .You hulled them with that observation matey.
| Quote: | You could cross-post to that group, but cross-posting is like chumming
shark infested waters.
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Some one might just cross-post it for you as I've found out.
The difference in the groups is why I don't like to crosspost. Ienjoy the
different tacks each group tales and cross-posting leads to homogenation.
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Tony Cooper
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:01 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 21:11:16 -0400, "ray o'hara" <roh@comcast.net>
wrote:
| Quote: |
"Tony Cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ig5pi1lef3pasabp9sdtcn1hf14hfdakad@4ax.com...
On 17 Sep 2005 17:30:37 -0400, Thomas Easterling
The aue group has a tendency to focus on the associated bits and
ignore the basic question.
ARRRGH .You hulled them with that observation matey.
You could cross-post to that group, but cross-posting is like chumming
shark infested waters.
Some one might just cross-post it for you as I've found out.
The difference in the groups is why I don't like to crosspost. Ienjoy the
different tacks each group tales and cross-posting leads to homogenation.
Hey now! No sexual orientation innuendos! |
--
Tony Cooper
Orlando, FL |
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ray o'hara
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:01 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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"Tony Cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ptgpi1tsdm2fv36v2qa06vp2p3e3jv6oen@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 21:11:16 -0400, "ray o'hara" <roh@comcast.net
wrote:
"Tony Cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ig5pi1lef3pasabp9sdtcn1hf14hfdakad@4ax.com...
On 17 Sep 2005 17:30:37 -0400, Thomas Easterling
The aue group has a tendency to focus on the associated bits and
ignore the basic question.
ARRRGH .You hulled them with that observation matey.
You could cross-post to that group, but cross-posting is like chumming
shark infested waters.
Some one might just cross-post it for you as I've found out.
The difference in the groups is why I don't like to crosspost. Ienjoy
the
different tacks each group tales and cross-posting leads to homogenation.
Hey now! No sexual orientation innuendos!
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We are talking about ships. |
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Weatherlawyer
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 12:22 pm
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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Probably asking the wrong person but where do all the witty people hang
out? |
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J. J. Lodder
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 2:56 pm
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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ray o'hara <roh@comcast.net> wrote:
| Quote: | "Tony Cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ptgpi1tsdm2fv36v2qa06vp2p3e3jv6oen@4ax.com...
On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 21:11:16 -0400, "ray o'hara" <roh@comcast.net
wrote:
"Tony Cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ig5pi1lef3pasabp9sdtcn1hf14hfdakad@4ax.com...
On 17 Sep 2005 17:30:37 -0400, Thomas Easterling
The aue group has a tendency to focus on the associated bits and
ignore the basic question.
ARRRGH .You hulled them with that observation matey.
You could cross-post to that group, but cross-posting is like chumming
shark infested waters.
Some one might just cross-post it for you as I've found out.
The difference in the groups is why I don't like to crosspost. Ienjoy
the
different tacks each group tales and cross-posting leads to homogenation.
Hey now! No sexual orientation innuendos!
We are talking about ships.
|
The bowsprit gets mixed with the rudder sometimes,
when the ship becomes snarked,
Jan |
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Armond Perretta
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 6:35 pm
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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Tony Cooper wrote:
| Quote: | Thomas Easterling <zzzthomzzz@talk21.com> wrote:
Thomas Easterling wrote:
I'm in the middle of a, ummm, 'heated debate' about the verb "to
way" as applied to ships.
Someone claims that "The crew ways the ship" is quite standard Navy
terminology to mean that the crew are controlling or driving or
piloting -- or whatever the right word is! -- the ship.
Our resident expert in all things seafaring is Armond Peretta ...
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No weigh, curd.
--
Good luck and good sailing.
s/v Kerry Deare of Barnegat
http://home.comcast.net/~kerrydeare |
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Tony Cooper
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:20 pm
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 08:35:49 -0400, "Armond Perretta"
<newsgroupreader@REMOVEcomcast.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Tony Cooper wrote:
Thomas Easterling <zzzthomzzz@talk21.com> wrote:
Thomas Easterling wrote:
I'm in the middle of a, ummm, 'heated debate' about the verb "to
way" as applied to ships.
Someone claims that "The crew ways the ship" is quite standard Navy
terminology to mean that the crew are controlling or driving or
piloting -- or whatever the right word is! -- the ship.
Our resident expert in all things seafaring is Armond Peretta ...
No weigh, curd.
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To are, or not to are; that should have been my question.
--
Tony Cooper
Orlando, FL |
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Don Phillipson
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 4:19 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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"Weatherlawyer" <Weatherlawyer@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1126993482.910466.214170@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | Besides; I doubt any of their crew have weighed a ship since Popeye. I
blieve the RN method is based on a fellow called Plimsoll
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The RN has no particular method of weighing ships but used
(until recently) the crazy but traditional international method
(e.g. counting a cubic yard of cargo space as one ton.)
The Plimsoll line is a totally civilian instrument, actually a
set of three lines painted on a ship's hull to show its maximum
safe displacement under specified conditions. For British
ships, the Plimsoll line is enforced by the Board of Trade
(not the Royal Navy.)
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada) |
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Robert Lieblich
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 7:04 am
Post subject: Re: The crew ways the ship? |
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Weatherlawyer wrote:
| Quote: |
Probably asking the wrong person but where do all the witty people hang
out?
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Not on Usenet.
--
Bob Lieblich
By definition, unwitty |
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