"...they're having a row with the wankers"

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"...they're having a row with the wankers"
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Troy Steadman
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:01 pm Post subject: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

In "300 reasons why we love The Simpsons" we have this paragraph: http://observer.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,6903,939751,00.html 63 They get British humour. And throw it back at us, as in... Bart: 'You're watching PBS?' Homer: 'Hey, I'm as surprised as you, but I stumbled across the most delicious British sitcom.' Bart: [reading title] 'Do Shut Up'? Homer: 'It's about a hard-drinking yet loving family of soccer hooligans. If they're not having a go with the birds, they're having a row with the wankers.' Could one of you Americans tell me what - if anything - that last sentence means?

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 5:07 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Troy Steadman wrote:

Quote:

In "300 reasons why we love The Simpsons" we have this paragraph:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,6903,939751,00.html

63 They get British humour. And throw it back at us, as in... Bart:
'You're watching PBS?' Homer: 'Hey, I'm as surprised as you, but I
stumbled across the most delicious British sitcom.' Bart: [reading
title] 'Do Shut Up'? Homer: 'It's about a hard-drinking yet loving
family of soccer hooligans. If they're not having a go with the birds,
they're having a row with the wankers.'

Could one of you Americans tell me what - if anything - that last
sentence means?

It's just making fun of British people using characteristic British
language not typically used by Americans. The following terms are
thought of as chiefly British:

"bird" (woman)
"row" (argument) (I wonder if the quotation reveals a lack of
knowledge of the pronunciation? But that just shows you that it's not a
term typically used in AmE [whether it actually is more common in modern
BrE, or just tends to show up in the archaic BrE material we're exposed
to, I don't know])
"wanker" (all usages)

I don't think of "having a go" as being typically British, but perhaps it
is -- there's a tendency for British speakers to use similar phrases like
"have a think"... on the other hand, "have a look" is AmE.

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 5:10 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Tony Cooper wrote:

Quote:

I think that if I heard "I was chatting up this bird and some wanker
spilled his pint on me trousers." I might assume the speaker was from
somewhere in the isles.

Drifting a bit....I usually associate the use of "me" as used above
with Irish-speak. Last night I was watching "Shirley Valentine" on
HBO and noticed that the Liverpuddlian Shirley used "me" thusly.

I associate this possessive "me" with the Beatles myself; it seems to
occur in lots of nonstandard BrE dialects. TTBOMK possessive "me" occurs
naturally in *no* AmE dialect (other than Popeye's, if that can be
considered AmE).

Tony Cooper
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:30 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

On 17 Aug 2005 00:01:47 -0700, "Troy Steadman"
<troysteadman@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Quote:

If someone in the family isn't chasing girls, they're having an
argument with someone that annoys them.

Maybe. It's not a particularly well-worded line to get across what
they wanted to get across.

--
Tony Cooper
Orlando FL

Jim Lawton
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:30:11 GMT, Tony Cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net>
wrote:

Quote:

On 17 Aug 2005 00:01:47 -0700, "Troy Steadman"
troysteadman@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

In "300 reasons why we love The Simpsons" we have this paragraph:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,6903,939751,00.html

63 They get British humour. And throw it back at us, as in... Bart:
'You're watching PBS?' Homer: 'Hey, I'm as surprised as you, but I
stumbled across the most delicious British sitcom.' Bart: [reading
title] 'Do Shut Up'? Homer: 'It's about a hard-drinking yet loving
family of soccer hooligans. If they're not having a go with the birds,
they're having a row with the wankers.'

Could one of you Americans tell me what - if anything - that last
sentence means?

If someone in the family isn't chasing girls, they're having an
argument with someone that annoys them.

Maybe. It's not a particularly well-worded line to get across what
they wanted to get across.

Is it just pseudo BrE to give that flavour for American viewers? Do left-ponders

ever use "wanker"? Does anyone still say "bird" - and does it sound BrE to an
American ear?

--
Jim
"a single species has come to dominate ...
reproducing at bacterial levels, almost as an
infectious plague envelops its host"
http://tinyurl.com/c88xs

Tony Cooper
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:12 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:40:17 GMT, Jim Lawton
<ucan@use.your.initiative> wrote:

Quote:

Is it just pseudo BrE to give that flavour for American viewers? Do left-ponders
ever use "wanker"? Does anyone still say "bird" - and does it sound BrE to an
American ear?

Americans would not use "wanker", but - today - terms like this are at
least understood by many Americans. We read and watch movies and TV.

"Bird" may be in the same category, but I have the feeling that it
might be used in the US by some musicians. Not being a musician or
one who hangs out with them, I'm not current, though.

I suppose that both terms sound "British", but an equal number of the
usages I've seen of "wanker" have been in soc.culture.irish. I don't
think they are mimicking the Brits so they must have some claim to the
word.

I think that if I heard "I was chatting up this bird and some wanker
spilled his pint on me trousers." I might assume the speaker was from
somewhere in the isles.

Drifting a bit....I usually associate the use of "me" as used above
with Irish-speak. Last night I was watching "Shirley Valentine" on
HBO and noticed that the Liverpuddlian Shirley used "me" thusly.

That was such a great movie. I'd seen "Shirley Valentine" as a stage
play in Windsor. It's one of the few instances where the movie and
the play were somewhat different but both good in their own way.

Was "Shirley Valentine" the only major role for Pauline Collins? I
don't think I've ever seen her in anything else. At least to notice.
Now that I've Googled her, I do think I remember her in "Upstairs,
Downstairs", but the rest of her credits are unfamiliar to me.

--
Tony Cooper
Orlando FL

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:19 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Jim Lawton wrote:

Quote:

Do left-ponders ever use "wanker"?

Sure, rarely, but when it happens it's done with consciousness that it's a
British slang word. That's partly why it's humorous.

In my freshman year of college, there was a guy who used "wanker" a lot.
I think it might be related to the apparent appropriation of certain
pseudo-British accent features in forming the "stoner accent" (which is
heard on _The Simpsons_ in the 'Spike' character BTW). This is the same
guy who always said "shrooms" for "mushrooms" when ordering pizza.

Quote:

Does anyone still say "bird"

Dunno.

Quote:

- and does it sound BrE to an American ear?

Unquestionably, except for the vast numbers of Americans who aren't even
familiar with this usage of 'bird'. We aren't all as knowledgeable about
British culture as Coop might lead you to believe.

Quote:

I haven't seen the show, but that's my guess from the dialogue quoted.
The mythical Britcom is, I think, represented as introducing new
terminology to Homer. Yet another example of Americans using irony.

I'm not sure, but I think part of the attraction of Britcoms to Americans
is something that doesn't go to their intrinsic artistic worth but to the
exoticism value. I mean, *someone* out there is watching _Keeping Up
Appearances_, and Coop's probably not the only one.

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:21 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Tony Cooper wrote:

Quote:

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 15:07:54 +0000 (UTC), Areff <me@privacy.net
wrote:

It's just making fun of British people using characteristic British
language not typically used by Americans. The following terms are
thought of as chiefly British:

"bird" (woman)
"row" (argument) (I wonder if the quotation reveals a lack of
knowledge of the pronunciation? But that just shows you that it's not a
term typically used in AmE [whether it actually is more common in modern
BrE, or just tends to show up in the archaic BrE material we're exposed
to, I don't know])

"Row", as in "having a row with his wife" is uncommon in AmE?

I believe so. Certainly it's uncommon in ordinary conversational usage.
Not so uncommon for me to think of it as British per se, but when I think
of the word I imagine it being said in a British accent.

I'd say "row" is somewhat more common in AmE than "whilst", which you used
to use.

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:25 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Mike Lyle wrote:

Quote:

Areff wrote:
Troy Steadman wrote:
In "300 reasons why we love The Simpsons" we have [...]
birds, they're having a row with the wankers.'

Could one of you Americans tell me what - if anything - that last
sentence means?

It's just making fun of British people using characteristic British
language not typically used by Americans. The following terms are
thought of as chiefly British:

[...]
"wanker" (all usages)
[...]

But what struck me most forcibly was that the supposedly prudish US
let "wankers" through the TV net.

Reminiscent, perhaps, of the usage of "shag" in the _Austin Powers_
movies, including in the *title* of one of them. A sufficiently exotic
term easily gets past the censors.

R H Draney
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:15 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Tony Cooper filted:

Quote:

Was "Shirley Valentine" the only major role for Pauline Collins? I
don't think I've ever seen her in anything else. At least to notice.
Now that I've Googled her, I do think I remember her in "Upstairs,
Downstairs", but the rest of her credits are unfamiliar to me.

Nothing else at IMDb leaps out at me, and most of the roles listed are in
television rather than feature films...I see she was in a "Doctor Who" ("The
Faceless Ones") back in '67....r

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:27 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

R H Draney wrote:

Quote:

the Omrud filted:

It's just not a rude word in the US. Same with Bollocks - there was
a car in California with a vanity plate of "BOLOCKS" or something
similar (IIUC, vanity plates can only have up to 7 letters).

I think you can go eight in California...it should be pointed out that the
nearest US equivalent to the word is spelled "bollix", which is a verb, and that
there's a well-known department store chain in California and elsewhere called
"Bullock's"....r

Isn't "bollix", as in "bollixed up", itself a BrEism, derived from
"bollocks"?

the Omrud
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:02 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Tony Cooper spake thusly:

Quote:

Drifting a bit....I usually associate the use of "me" as used above
with Irish-speak. Last night I was watching "Shirley Valentine" on
HBO and noticed that the Liverpuddlian Shirley used "me" thusly.

It's used throughout the UK in informal speech. I use it meself. I
don't think it's even marked for class.

I don't recall any previous discussion here of the "singular us" in
UK speech (but not usually in writing). It is perfectly common to
refer to yourself as "us" under certain circumstances: "Give us a
cuddle", "Throw us that towel", "Pass us the salt, please".

Quote:

That was such a great movie. I'd seen "Shirley Valentine" as a stage
play in Windsor. It's one of the few instances where the movie and
the play were somewhat different but both good in their own way.

Was "Shirley Valentine" the only major role for Pauline Collins? I
don't think I've ever seen her in anything else. At least to notice.
Now that I've Googled her, I do think I remember her in "Upstairs,
Downstairs", but the rest of her credits are unfamiliar to me.

She's been well-known as a TV actress in the UK for decades, often
with her husband John Alderton. Although both have had movie roles,
they have either failed to break through into films, or just weren't
interested.

--
David
=====
replace usenet with the

Areff
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:16 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

R H Draney wrote:

Quote:

Areff filted:

In my freshman year of college, there was a guy who used "wanker" a lot.
I think it might be related to the apparent appropriation of certain
pseudo-British accent features in forming the "stoner accent" (which is
heard on _The Simpsons_ in the 'Spike' character BTW).

Can't place Spike...if you mean "Snake", he sounds Baltimorean to me....

Sorry, I meant 'Snake'.

Hank Azaria reportedly has said that he modeled the voice of Snake on that
of a "druggie" student he knew at Tufts, Cliff Tazner. A Baltimorean origin
for Tazner is not beyond the realm of possibility. Nevertheless, the
basic features of Snake's accent, and in particular what I'd call, for
lack of a better description, the selective pseudo-faux-British elements,
is something I've also seen in other adolescent members of subcultures of
heavy drug users. No one seems to know *why* this accent exists, or
where precisely it comes from, and whether the British similarities are
purely coincidental or not, but some sort of music-related influence seems
likely.

As for Baltimore, I'm not familiar enough with such accents, but no one on
_Homicide: Life on the Street_ talked like Snake.

mark
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:19 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

Legend tells of a time when the mysterious hermit the Omrud of
usenet.omrud@gmail.com returned briefly from exile to say ...

Quote:

Tony Cooper spake thusly:
Drifting a bit....I usually associate the use of "me" as used above
with Irish-speak. Last night I was watching "Shirley Valentine" on
HBO and noticed that the Liverpuddlian Shirley used "me" thusly.

It's used throughout the UK in informal speech. I use it meself. I
don't think it's even marked for class.

I don't recall any previous discussion here of the "singular us" in
UK speech (but not usually in writing). It is perfectly common to
refer to yourself as "us" under certain circumstances: "Give us a
cuddle", "Throw us that towel", "Pass us the salt, please".

Chuck us me spanner, mate ... oh, strewth! I didn't say "peg" it at
me, ya burk!

--
My housekeeper regarded him with jaundice in her eye;
She did not want a colony of hippotami;
She borrowed a machine-gun from her soldier-nephew, Percy,
And showed my hippopotamus no hippopotamercy.
- Patrick Barrington, "I Had a Hippopotamus"

the Omrud
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:29 pm Post subject: Re: "...they're having a row with the wankers"

mark spake thusly:

Quote:

Legend tells of a time when the mysterious hermit the Omrud of
usenet.omrud@gmail.com returned briefly from exile to say ...
Tony Cooper spake thusly:
Drifting a bit....I usually associate the use of "me" as used above
with Irish-speak. Last night I was watching "Shirley Valentine" on
HBO and noticed that the Liverpuddlian Shirley used "me" thusly.

It's used throughout the UK in informal speech. I use it meself. I
don't think it's even marked for class.

I don't recall any previous discussion here of the "singular us" in
UK speech (but not usually in writing). It is perfectly common to
refer to yourself as "us" under certain circumstances: "Give us a
cuddle", "Throw us that towel", "Pass us the salt, please".

Chuck us me spanner, mate ... oh, strewth! I didn't say "peg" it at
me, ya burk!

Or, as it says in Viz, "Hoy us me tabs".

--
David
=====
replace usenet with the

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