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Arthur
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 1:05 am
Post subject: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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Hello.
Could anyone please explain to me the difference in usage of "holiday" /
"holidays"?
And am I right that the word "vacation" is the American equivalent of
British "holiday(s)"?
Thank you!
Arthur
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Tony Mountifield
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 1:05 am
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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In article <emjte.3116$kP3.130@fe65.usenetserver.com>,
Arthur <plc@postmark.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Hello.
Could anyone please explain to me the difference in usage of "holiday" /
"holidays"?
And am I right that the word "vacation" is the American equivalent of
British "holiday(s)"?
Thank you!
|
In British English, people go "on holiday" when referring to a time of
recreation away from home, and this is indeed what the Americans call
going "on vacation".
"Holidays" (plural) is usually used to refer to periods of time, such as
the school holidays. I think in US English, "holidays" is most frequently
used to refer to the Christmas season (possibly including Thankgiving?),
where people will say "Happy Holidays" as a secular alternative to
"Happy Christmas".
In British English, you could also ask "how many holidays did you have
last year?", to which an answer might be "two: skiing in January and
sailing in July", for example.
I believe that the singular "holiday" in US English usually means
a public holiday, which in British English is called a "bank holiday",
i.e. a day when most businesses are closed.
Cheers
Tony
--
Tony Mountifield
Work: tony@softins.co.uk - http://www.softins.co.uk
Play: tony@mountifield.org - http://tony.mountifield.org |
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Molly Mockford
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:15 am
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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At 21:05:50 on Sun, 19 Jun 2005, Arthur <plc@postmark.net> wrote in
<emjte.3116$kP3.130@fe65.usenetserver.com>:
| Quote: | Could anyone please explain to me the difference in usage of "holiday"
/ "holidays"?
And am I right that the word "vacation" is the American equivalent of
British "holiday(s)"?
|
Yes, and the Americans say "holidays" where in the UK we say
"Christmas".
--
Molly Mockford
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin
(My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.)
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Dave Fawthrop
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:37 am
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 20:27:30 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk (Tony
Mountifield) wrote:
| I believe that the singular "holiday" in US English usually means
| a public holiday, which in British English is called a "bank holiday",
| i.e. a day when most businesses are closed.
Except the Supermarkets which open 1000 to 1600 hrs.
--
Dave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> http://www.webshots.com
Thousands of wonderful professional photos for your Wallpaper and
Screensaver. also 200,000 amateur pics. Four new pics each day. |
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Arthur
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 3:01 am
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
Dave Fawthrop wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 20:27:30 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk (Tony
Mountifield) wrote:
| I believe that the singular "holiday" in US English usually means
| a public holiday, which in British English is called a "bank holiday",
| i.e. a day when most businesses are closed.
Except the Supermarkets which open 1000 to 1600 hrs.
Oh dear, oh dear...... |
And.... I always told my students something like the following to
explain the "bank holidays':
The banks close on certain weekends, so the shops close because thay
can't / couldn't take their money to the bank at the end of the day,
so... the supermarkets close etc... A kind of chain reaction....
I was wrong.... thank you for your explanation!
Arthur |
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Matthew Huntbach
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:24 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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On Sun, 19 Jun 2005, Dave Fawthrop wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 20:27:30 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk (Tony
Mountifield) wrote:
| I believe that the singular "holiday" in US English usually means
| a public holiday, which in British English is called a "bank holiday",
| i.e. a day when most businesses are closed.
Except the Supermarkets which open 1000 to 1600 hrs.
|
There is still a law, a remnant of the old Sunday Trading Law which
banned certain business altogether on Sundays, which says that
large retail stores may only open for 6 hours on a Sunday. The
six hours chosen tend to be 1000 to 1600 or 1000 to 1700.
The same law does not apply to Bank Holidays, however. Where I
am (London) it seems to be increasingly common that supermarkets
and the like remain open on Bank Holidays for as long as they would on
any other weekday.
Matthew Huntbach |
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Nick Wagg
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:40 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
"Arthur" <plc@postmark.net> wrote in message
news:Q2lte.5933$jW6.3643@fe40.usenetserver.com...
| Quote: | Dave Fawthrop wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 20:27:30 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk (Tony
Mountifield) wrote:
| I believe that the singular "holiday" in US English usually means
| a public holiday, which in British English is called a "bank holiday",
| i.e. a day when most businesses are closed.
Except the Supermarkets which open 1000 to 1600 hrs.
Oh dear, oh dear......
And.... I always told my students something like the following to
explain the "bank holidays':
The banks close on certain weekends, so the shops close because thay
can't / couldn't take their money to the bank at the end of the day,
so... the supermarkets close etc... A kind of chain reaction....
I was wrong.... thank you for your explanation!
|
I think your explanation was correct in the 1960s but they times,
they are a-changing.
You may like to visit http://www.dti.gov.uk/er/bankhol.htm which
outlines some of the idiosyncratic ways in which bank holidays
are determined. |
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Brian {Hamilton Kelly}
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:34 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
On Monday, in article
<Pine.LNX.4.61.0506200919290.27769@frank.dcs.qmul.ac.uk>
mmh@dcs.qmul.ac.uk "Matthew Huntbach" wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 19 Jun 2005, Dave Fawthrop wrote:
Except the Supermarkets which open 1000 to 1600 hrs.
There is still a law, a remnant of the old Sunday Trading Law which
banned certain business altogether on Sundays, which says that
|
Errm, that's the *new* Sunday Trading Act (passed in 1994) which got rid
of all the anomalies with the old piecemeal legislation which applied to
shopping on Sundays.
| Quote: | large retail stores may only open for 6 hours on a Sunday. The
|
Large meaning "of greater than 6000 sq ft trading area".
| Quote: | six hours chosen tend to be 1000 to 1600 or 1000 to 1700.
|
ITYM 1100--1700.
| Quote: | The same law does not apply to Bank Holidays, however. Where I
am (London) it seems to be increasingly common that supermarkets
and the like remain open on Bank Holidays for as long as they would on
any other weekday.
|
Indeed; it's only the old-style retailers (and the banks, and anything
public-service, such as libraries) that close on Bank Holidays.
After all, it makes a lot of sense to provide a catchment mechanism for
all the wealth in the plastic of those whose employer has given a day
off.
The only time when a retailer MUST shut up shop entirely is on Easter Day
itself (and even then small shopkeepers are exempt).
--
Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk
"Je n'ai fait celle-ci plus longue que parce que je n'ai pas eu
le loisir de la faire plus courte."
Blaise Pascal, /Lettres Provinciales/, 1657 |
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sum1
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:30 am
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
tony@softins.clara.co.uk wrote:
| Quote: | In article <emjte.3116$kP3.130@fe65.usenetserver.com>,
Arthur <plc@postmark.net> wrote:
Hello.
Could anyone please explain to me the difference in usage of "holiday" /
"holidays"?
And am I right that the word "vacation" is the American equivalent of
British "holiday(s)"?
Thank you!
In British English, people go "on holiday" when referring to a time of
recreation away from home, and this is indeed what the Americans call
going "on vacation".
"Holidays" (plural) is usually used to refer to periods of time, such as
the school holidays. I think in US English, "holidays" is most frequently
used to refer to the Christmas season (possibly including Thankgiving?),
where people will say "Happy Holidays" as a secular alternative to
"Happy Christmas".
Not just these two. I hear people - bank tellers, counter clerks/shop |
assistants, etc - here routinely saying "have a great holiday',
and 'y'all have a great holiday now!', a few days before almost any national
holiday. Of which, I might add, there seem to be an excessive
number in the calendar!
| Quote: | I believe that the singular "holiday" in US English usually means
a public holiday, which in British English is called a "bank holiday",
i.e. a day when most businesses are closed.
Cheers
Tony
|
Right: I find "Bank Holiday" is never used here.
Most non-government businesses, food stores (supermarkets), department stores,
even banks are open on some or all of the national holidays. Thanksgiving Day
(the 4th Thursday in November I think it falls on), the 4th of July,
and Christmas Day are the ones almost everyone likes to have off.
--
Ian |
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Dave Fawthrop
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:43 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 21:34:57 +0100 (BST), bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton
Kelly}) wrote:
| Indeed; it's only the old-style retailers (and the banks, and anything
| public-service, such as libraries) that close on Bank Holidays.
|
| After all, it makes a lot of sense to provide a catchment mechanism for
| all the wealth in the plastic of those whose employer has given a day
| off.
That is a *very* modern view of holidays, which has only been applicable
for 50, 100 or at the most 200 years. The word was originally Holy Day
when the Church decreed that: According to the Bible one worked for 6 days
and had the seventh for rest. There were also many Saints days and other
Feast days which were Holy, and so one did not work. This makes seine
because he peasants needed time to attend church, tend the gardens look
after the pig, and other. Train at archery. etc. and generally have a rest,
--
Dave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> http://www.webshots.com
Thousands of wonderful professional photos for your Wallpaper and
Screensaver. also 200,000 amateur pics. Four new pics each day. |
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Paul Burke
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:14 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
|
|
Dave Fawthrop wrote:
| Quote: | Hamilton
Kelly}) wrote:
| After all, it makes a lot of sense to provide a catchment mechanism for
| all the wealth in the plastic of those whose employer has given a day
| off.
That is a *very* modern view of holidays, which has only been applicable
for 50, 100 or at the most 200 years.
|
Come off it, wakes weeks- people saved 51 weeks of the year to blue the
lot in a week at Blackpool for the mill girls, the Isle of Man for the
office clerks. That was a hundred and more years ago. 50 years ago was
1955, many people even had horseless carriages by then. 200 years isn't
modern- the possibilities of travel didn't exist before the railway
network- think Thomas Cook.
The 'modern' holiday has really taken the place of the fairs, which were
nothing if not commercial.
Paul Burke |
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Dave Fawthrop
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:59 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 08:14:54 +0100, Paul Burke <paul@scazon.com> wrote:
| Dave Fawthrop wrote:
| > Hamilton
| > Kelly}) wrote:
| >
| >
| > | After all, it makes a lot of sense to provide a catchment mechanism for
| > | all the wealth in the plastic of those whose employer has given a day
| > | off.
| >
| > That is a *very* modern view of holidays, which has only been applicable
| > for 50, 100 or at the most 200 years.
Sorry that should have been 300 years.
| Come off it, wakes weeks- people saved 51 weeks of the year to blue the
| lot in a week at Blackpool for the mill girls, the Isle of Man for the
| office clerks. That was a hundred and more years ago. 50 years ago was
| 1955, many people even had horseless carriages by then. 200 years isn't
| modern- the possibilities of travel didn't exist before the railway
| network- think Thomas Cook.
Where I came from I remember two wakes weeks one for the Engineers and one
for the Woolen mills.
Wakes Weeks are a relatively modern invention, which only make sense after
introduction of the Factory system by Arkwright in 1771 at Cromford Mill.
http://www.thepeakdistrict.info/fast/html/cromford_mill.html
| The 'modern' holiday has really taken the place of the fairs, which were
| nothing if not commercial.
Fairs were, and still are in country areas classed a _work_ by the farmers,
because they buy/bought livestock and other work necessities at fairs. The
other things were incidental. Well, when not at home, one must drink and
eat, and chat to others about work.  Only this year I bought some
agricultural 2 ft long Cable Ties at Masham at what is left of a fair.
SOED lists an Anglo Saxon derivation for Holy Day. For Holiday it has Old
English and Middle English derivations. It also gives usages for 1440, and
1526. It also references each form to the other.
--
Dave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> http://www.webshots.com
Thousands of wonderful professional photos for your Wallpaper and
Screensaver. also 200,000 amateur pics. Four new pics each day. |
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Matthew Huntbach
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 3:02 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
|
|
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005, Brian {Hamilton Kelly} wrote:
| Quote: | mmh@dcs.qmul.ac.uk "Matthew Huntbach" wrote:
There is still a law, a remnant of the old Sunday Trading Law which
banned certain business altogether on Sundays, which says that
Errm, that's the *new* Sunday Trading Act (passed in 1994) which got rid
of all the anomalies with the old piecemeal legislation which applied to
shopping on Sundays.
|
Yes, that's what I meant. There were once very extensive
restrictions on trading on Sundays. The fact that there are
still some restrictions is a remnant of the idea, enshrined
in older legislation, that any non essential work should
be banned on Sundays.
| Quote: | six hours chosen tend to be 1000 to 1600 or 1000 to 1700.
ITYM 1100--1700.
|
Yes, must have mis-typed.
Matthew Huntbach |
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Paul Burke
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 4:23 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
Dave Fawthrop wrote:
Of course that's true, but as I was saying, anything before mass
transport was another world. Holidaying, in the sense of 'having time
off', was less tied to holy days after the Reformation(s). They were
virtually abolished during the Commonwealth period, and only restored
afterwards in a fairly attenuated form. That didn't stop people wanting
time off- if they could get it:
I've waited longing for today:
Spindle, bobbin, and spool, away!
In joy and bliss I'm off to play
Upon this high holiday.
Spindle, bobbin, and spool, away,
For joy that it's a holiday!
The dirt upon the floor's unswept,
The fireplace isn't cleaned and kept,
I haven't cut the rushes yet
Upon this high holiday.
Spindle, bobbin, etc.
The cooking herbs I must fetch in,
And fix my kerchief under my chin.
Darling Jack, lend me a pin
To fix me well this holiday!
Spindle, bobbin, etc.
Now midday has almost come,
And all my chores are still not done
I'll clean my shoes till they become
Bright for a high holiday.
Spindle, bobbin, etc.
In pails the milk has got to go;
I ought to spread this bowl of dough -
It clogs my nails and fingers so
As I knead this holiday!
Spindle, bobbin, etc.
Handweavers and many other skilled artisans were condemned during the
period of their prosperity for taking time off when they felt like it-
to the millowners, one of the advantages of the new systemn was that the
lower orders were kept strictly disciplined.
The holiday in the sense of 'going away' is a democratisation of the
aristocratic enlightenement Grand Tour.
Paul Burke |
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John Briggs
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:12 pm
Post subject: Re: holiday/holidays/vacation |
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|
Dave Fawthrop wrote:
| Quote: |
SOED lists an Anglo Saxon derivation for Holy Day. For Holiday it
has Old English and Middle English derivations. It also gives usages
for 1440, and 1526. It also references each form to the other.
|
Just out of interest, how do you distinguish between Anglo-Saxon and Old
English?
--
John Briggs |
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