| Author |
Message |
Donna Richoux
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 3:15 am
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
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John Dean <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote:
| Quote: | jerry_friedman@yahoo.com wrote:
Donna Richoux wrote:
Then I believe it hangs together: "If ever I sow my wheat without
brining, I am a fool. I would be a fool to sow my wheat without
brining."
I don't think the author means us to rely on Luke. It looks to me
like we're invited to smile at his misunderstanding of his old
master's phrase, just as we are at his prejudice.
That's my take on it.
|
We're supposed to agree that Luke does not know anything about
*Dutchmen.* But that's different than the agricultural advice.
It's not Luke who gives the advice about brining. He is quoting his old
master, who he describes as having been "a knowin' man" -- a
knowledgeable person.
my old master, as war a knowin' man, used to say, says he, 'If e'er
I sow my wheat wi'out brinin', I'm a Dutchman,' says he;
and then Luke goes on to explain what he meant and why he brought it up.
I grant you that the conversation is about Dutchmen and Luke is
demonstrating provincial attitudes towards them. I just thought I should
underscore that "brining" was the original question.
Anyway, the advice works out to be, to brine wheat. Archbishop of
Canterbury, Dutchman, or fool, the knowing old master is none of those
things, so he never went without brining.
--
Best -- Donna Richoux |
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Jess Askin
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 4:09 am
Post subject: Re: fictional counties [WAS: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin'] |
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"Donna Richoux" <trio@euronet.nl> wrote in message
news:1grz1z9.9y60172ot60wN%trio@euronet.nl...
| Quote: | Jess Askin <dontbother@nospam.net> wrote:
"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:379re2F56r2qkU1@individual.net...
Jess Askin wrote:
"Marius Hancu" <NOSPAM@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:vtLPd.1329$Sw6.70904@weber.videotron.net...
Hello:
This must be dialect.
No doubt. But does anybody know what dialect? Where exactly is the
Floss, anyway? And do they have exceptionally good dental health
there?
[...]
They have excellent grinders. She was from Warwickshire, and I think
all the books are set in the English Midlands, in the next county to
Borsetshire.
Wow -- I didn't think at this point there was an English county I hadn't
heard of. Amusing that of the first two items on Google, one is the
Borsetshire Hunt (soon to be out of business, I suppose) and the second
is a
proposal that the public library in Borsetshire should stock more erotic
fiction on its shelves. There'll always be -- something or other, I
suppose.
I never knew about Borsetshire, but I knew of Barsetshire. I see that
Wikipedia has a list of fictional counties:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_counties
|
Oh duh -- then Borsetshire *is* fictional. Well ain't I gullible. Obviously
there'd be more than 3550 Google hits if it wasn't. Guess that's what comes
from only barely being cognizant of the existence of The Archers. |
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Django Cat
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:15 am
Post subject: Re: fictional counties [WAS: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin'] |
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On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:09:36 -0600, "Jess Askin"
<dontbother@nospam.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Donna Richoux" <trio@euronet.nl> wrote in message
news:1grz1z9.9y60172ot60wN%trio@euronet.nl...
Jess Askin <dontbother@nospam.net> wrote:
"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:379re2F56r2qkU1@individual.net...
Jess Askin wrote:
"Marius Hancu" <NOSPAM@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:vtLPd.1329$Sw6.70904@weber.videotron.net...
Hello:
This must be dialect.
No doubt. But does anybody know what dialect? Where exactly is the
Floss, anyway? And do they have exceptionally good dental health
there?
[...]
They have excellent grinders. She was from Warwickshire, and I think
all the books are set in the English Midlands, in the next county to
Borsetshire.
Wow -- I didn't think at this point there was an English county I hadn't
heard of. Amusing that of the first two items on Google, one is the
Borsetshire Hunt (soon to be out of business, I suppose) and the second
is a
proposal that the public library in Borsetshire should stock more erotic
fiction on its shelves. There'll always be -- something or other, I
suppose.
I never knew about Borsetshire, but I knew of Barsetshire. I see that
Wikipedia has a list of fictional counties:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_counties
Oh duh -- then Borsetshire *is* fictional.
|
Ma! Say it ain't so! Ma! |
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Jess Askin
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:25 am
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
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"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:37c3dgF5acvukU1@individual.net...
| Quote: | Jess Askin wrote:
"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in [...]
Borsetshire.
Wow -- I didn't think at this point there was an English county I
hadn't heard of. Amusing that of the first two items on Google, one
is the Borsetshire Hunt (soon to be out of business, I suppose) and
the second is a proposal that the public library in Borsetshire
should stock more erotic fiction on its shelves. There'll always be
-- something or other, I suppose.
Pint o' Shire's, please Jess.
If it hasn't been done already, it would be nice of somebody to make
a catalogue raisonné of fictitious counties.
|
See Donna's post. But the list includes US counties. |
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Jess Askin
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:26 am
Post subject: Re: fictional counties [WAS: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin'] |
|
|
"Jess Askin" <dontbother@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:37cichF5cbr9tU1@individual.net...
| Quote: |
"Donna Richoux" <trio@euronet.nl> wrote in message
news:1grz1z9.9y60172ot60wN%trio@euronet.nl...
Jess Askin <dontbother@nospam.net> wrote:
"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:379re2F56r2qkU1@individual.net...
Jess Askin wrote:
"Marius Hancu" <NOSPAM@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:vtLPd.1329$Sw6.70904@weber.videotron.net...
Hello:
This must be dialect.
No doubt. But does anybody know what dialect? Where exactly is the
Floss, anyway? And do they have exceptionally good dental health
there?
[...]
They have excellent grinders. She was from Warwickshire, and I think
all the books are set in the English Midlands, in the next county to
Borsetshire.
Wow -- I didn't think at this point there was an English county I
hadn't
heard of. Amusing that of the first two items on Google, one is the
Borsetshire Hunt (soon to be out of business, I suppose) and the
second
is a
proposal that the public library in Borsetshire should stock more
erotic
fiction on its shelves. There'll always be -- something or other, I
suppose.
I never knew about Borsetshire, but I knew of Barsetshire. I see that
Wikipedia has a list of fictional counties:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_counties
Oh duh -- then Borsetshire *is* fictional. Well ain't I gullible.
Obviously
there'd be more than 3550 Google hits if it wasn't. Guess that's what
comes
from only barely being cognizant of the existence of The Archers.
|
On reflection I have heard of The Archers -- but I thought they were a
production team in old movies -- Powell & Pressburger? |
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John Dean
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:16 am
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
|
|
Donna Richoux wrote:
| Quote: | John Dean <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote:
jerry_friedman@yahoo.com wrote:
Donna Richoux wrote:
Then I believe it hangs together: "If ever I sow my wheat without
brining, I am a fool. I would be a fool to sow my wheat without
brining."
I don't think the author means us to rely on Luke. It looks to me
like we're invited to smile at his misunderstanding of his old
master's phrase, just as we are at his prejudice.
That's my take on it.
We're supposed to agree that Luke does not know anything about
*Dutchmen.* But that's different than the agricultural advice.
It's not Luke who gives the advice about brining. He is quoting his
old master, who he describes as having been "a knowin' man" -- a
knowledgeable person.
my old master, as war a knowin' man, used to say, says he, 'If
e'er I sow my wheat wi'out brinin', I'm a Dutchman,' says he;
and then Luke goes on to explain what he meant and why he brought it
up. I grant you that the conversation is about Dutchmen and Luke is
demonstrating provincial attitudes towards them. I just thought I
should underscore that "brining" was the original question.
|
In my house we have spoken of little else.
| Quote: |
Anyway, the advice works out to be, to brine wheat. Archbishop of
Canterbury, Dutchman, or fool, the knowing old master is none of those
things, so he never went without brining.
|
Yep. The difference is that I think the old master meant "If you catch
me sowing without brining I'm a Dutchman and, since you can plainly see
I'm not a Dutchman, you may rely on it that I always brine."
Whereas Luke thinks he meant "Dutchmen are stupid because they sow
without brining. I'm an Englishman so I always brine."
We are, I believe, meant to smile at Luke because he takes things
literally and has a limited command of language. He's like the peasant
in Jean de Florette who hears Jean boast about planting "des
authentiques" and assumes an "authentique" is a kind of flower.
--
John Dean
Oxford |
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Donna Richoux
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:16 am
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
|
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Jess Askin <dontbother@nospam.net> wrote:
| Quote: | "Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
If it hasn't been done already, it would be nice of somebody to make
a catalogue raisonné of fictitious counties.
See Donna's post. But the list includes US counties.
|
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_counties
I just looked at the list again myself, and saw that it had this entry,
which is pertinent to the earlier question:
Loamshire, UK - George Eliot's fictional locale
There's no more data there about it, though.
--
Best - Donna Richoux |
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Jess Askin
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 3:14 pm
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
|
|
"Donna Richoux" <trio@euronet.nl> wrote in message
news:1gs05xc.2z3x5vcjrei9N%trio@euronet.nl...
| Quote: | Jess Askin <dontbother@nospam.net> wrote:
"Mike Lyle" <mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
If it hasn't been done already, it would be nice of somebody to make
a catalogue raisonné of fictitious counties.
See Donna's post. But the list includes US counties.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_counties
I just looked at the list again myself, and saw that it had this entry,
which is pertinent to the earlier question:
Loamshire, UK - George Eliot's fictional locale
|
Of Adam Bede at least -- but it is also identified as the locale of TMOTF? |
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Mike Page
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:20 pm
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 20:25:34 -0000, "Mike Lyle"
<mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: | Jess Askin wrote:
"Marius Hancu" <NOSPAM@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:vtLPd.1329$Sw6.70904@weber.videotron.net...
Hello:
This must be dialect.
No doubt. But does anybody know what dialect? Where exactly is the
Floss, anyway? And do they have exceptionally good dental health
there?
[...]
They have excellent grinders. She was from Warwickshire, and I think
all the books are set in the English Midlands, in the next county to
Borsetshire. Nuneaton is called "Milby", and "Middlemarch" is
Coventry, no?
|
I haven't read all this thread, but if we were talking Mill on
the Floss, it was set in Lincolnshire, a bit disguised. IIRC.
Mike Page |
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Mike Page
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 2:20 am
Post subject: Re: sowin' wheat wi'out brinin' |
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 13:20:42 GMT, mikeorang.page@ntlworld.com
(Mike Page) wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 20:25:34 -0000, "Mike Lyle"
mike_lyle_uk@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Jess Askin wrote:
"Marius Hancu" <NOSPAM@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:vtLPd.1329$Sw6.70904@weber.videotron.net...
Hello:
This must be dialect.
No doubt. But does anybody know what dialect? Where exactly is the
Floss, anyway? And do they have exceptionally good dental health
there?
[...]
They have excellent grinders. She was from Warwickshire, and I think
all the books are set in the English Midlands, in the next county to
Borsetshire. Nuneaton is called "Milby", and "Middlemarch" is
Coventry, no?
I haven't read all this thread, but if we were talking Mill on
the Floss, it was set in Lincolnshire, a bit disguised. IIRC.
|
I'm sorry, the apostrophe came by second class post.
Mike Page |
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