| Author |
Message |
mike morgan
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 3:21 am
Post subject: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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Hello,
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I admit,
but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows about one
of the cars only and one day finds out about another. Quite surprised he
asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and "no" and
still be telling the truth?
Thanks for your opinions,
Regards, Mike
PS. I expect Doctor Mike Lyle to state severe state of involvement in
superfluous interests in me and his readiness to prescribing me some
medicines. I only want to know how often to take them, thank you doc.
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Donna Richoux
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 4:04 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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mike morgan <zazoo33@wp.pl> wrote:
| Quote: | Hello,
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I admit,
but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows about one
of the cars only and one day finds out about another. Quite surprised he
asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and "no" and
still be telling the truth?
|
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called "the
whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do more than
merely "tell the truth."
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies it
with the full statement. "No, I have three."
--
Best - Donna Richoux |
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Skitt
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 4:38 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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Donna Richoux rakstija:
| Quote: | mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I
admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post
it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows
about one of the cars only and one day finds out about another.
Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
|
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile one and
is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
| Quote: | If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies it
with the full statement. "No, I have three."
|
Just "yes" or "no", please! 
--
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/
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don groves
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:08 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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In article <2uvlqsF2dq3tmU1@uni-berlin.de>, Skitt at skitt99
@comcast.net poured forth...
| Quote: |
Donna Richoux rakstija:
mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I
admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post
it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows
about one of the cars only and one day finds out about another.
Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile one and
is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies it
with the full statement. "No, I have three."
Just "yes" or "no", please!
|
I've often wondered what would happen if a witness so instructed
replied "I cannot answer that question "yes" or "no" within the
bounds of the oath I just took."
For example Q: "Do you own a house?" Suppose I own two houses.
Does "a" in this question mean "one", or does it mean "any".
Without knowing that, I can't truthfully answer either way.
--
dg (domain=ccwebster) |
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Skitt
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:43 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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don groves rakstija:
| Quote: | Skitt poured forth...
Donna Richoux rakstija:
mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I
admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post
it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows
about one of the cars only and one day finds out about another.
Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile
one and is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies it
with the full statement. "No, I have three."
Just "yes" or "no", please! ;-)
I've often wondered what would happen if a witness so instructed
replied "I cannot answer that question "yes" or "no" within the
bounds of the oath I just took."
For example Q: "Do you own a house?" Suppose I own two houses.
Does "a" in this question mean "one", or does it mean "any".
Without knowing that, I can't truthfully answer either way.
|
Well, when restricted to a "yes" or "no" answer, I'd choose the one that was
more advantageous to my cause, and let them *try* to prove perjury if they
thought I had committed it.
--
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/ |
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Mike Lyle
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 6:03 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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mike morgan wrote:
| Quote: | Hello,
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I
admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post
it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows
about one of the cars only and one day finds out about another.
Quite
surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no"
and still be telling the truth?
Thanks for your opinions,
Regards, Mike
PS. I expect Doctor Mike Lyle to state severe state of involvement
in
superfluous interests in me and his readiness to prescribing me
some
medicines. I only want to know how often to take them, thank you
doc. |
I'd say one tablet on rising, with food, and the other two with a
milky drink or a banana blitzed with orange juice before retiring.
Don't forget to clean your teeth, though. If you find your medication
makes you drowsy, don't drive or operate machinery. If people don't
start thinking you're normal in four weeks, come and see me again.
On the two-cars/three-cars question, this is what we doctors call a
"dilemma". The sophists of old used this kind of thing to upset
people; but we try not to do that these days. We prefer to let
patients take responsibility for their own mental health, so you
should really make a personal judgement based on the context of the
question. You see, the heart is a sort of pump...no, watch my hand ..
it goes "Squeeze-oh---squeeze-oh". I don't think you should be too
swayed by what you see on the Internet: a balanced diet will give you
everything you need.
There we are! Nothing to worry about! My receptionist will help you
sacrifice a cock to Aesculapius on the way out.
Mike. |
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don groves
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 6:56 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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In article <2uvpldF2dsv7oU1@uni-berlin.de>, Skitt at skitt99
@comcast.net poured forth...
| Quote: |
don groves rakstija:
Skitt poured forth...
Donna Richoux rakstija:
mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance, I
admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to post
it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who knows
about one of the cars only and one day finds out about another.
Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile
one and is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies it
with the full statement. "No, I have three."
Just "yes" or "no", please! ;-)
I've often wondered what would happen if a witness so instructed
replied "I cannot answer that question "yes" or "no" within the
bounds of the oath I just took."
For example Q: "Do you own a house?" Suppose I own two houses.
Does "a" in this question mean "one", or does it mean "any".
Without knowing that, I can't truthfully answer either way.
Well, when restricted to a "yes" or "no" answer, I'd choose the one that was
more advantageous to my cause, and let them *try* to prove perjury if they
thought I had committed it.
|
Yes, probably the better course.
Although it might be fun to answer the way I did above and force
the prosecutor to ask a more specific or better worded question,
possibly embarrassing him/her in the process. That strategy would
depend on how twitchy I thought judge's contempt trigger was.
--
dg (domain=ccwebster) |
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Maria Conlon
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 7:49 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
|
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don groves wrote:
| Quote: | Skitt poured forth...
don groves rakstija:
Skitt poured forth...
Donna Richoux rakstija:
mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance,
I admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to
post it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who
knows about one of the cars only and one day finds out about
another. Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile
one and is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies
it with the full statement. "No, I have three."
Just "yes" or "no", please! ;-)
I've often wondered what would happen if a witness so instructed
replied "I cannot answer that question "yes" or "no" within the
bounds of the oath I just took."
For example Q: "Do you own a house?" Suppose I own two houses.
Does "a" in this question mean "one", or does it mean "any".
Without knowing that, I can't truthfully answer either way.
Well, when restricted to a "yes" or "no" answer, I'd choose the one
that was more advantageous to my cause, and let them *try* to prove
perjury if they thought I had committed it.
Yes, probably the better course.
Although it might be fun to answer the way I did above and force
the prosecutor to ask a more specific or better worded question,
possibly embarrassing him/her in the process. That strategy would
depend on how twitchy I thought judge's contempt trigger was.
|
The original poster, Mike Morgan, wondered if he could answer both "yes"
and "no" to a question and still be telling the truth (about having
three cars when asked if he had two). I would propose answering "Yes and
no" -- those three words -- to questions like that. Even in court, it
seems that that would bring about another question, the answer to which
could clear up the matter.
But: When asked if I own a house, I would answer "yes" even if I own
more than one. "A house" would just signal "at least one house" to me.
Maria Conlon |
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Dylan Nicholson
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 7:50 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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"Maria Conlon" <mariaconlon001@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2v0112F2euqe0U1@uni-berlin.de...
| Quote: |
But: When asked if I own a house, I would answer "yes" even if I own
more than one. "A house" would just signal "at least one house" to me.
Same's true for car. The difference is "a" rather than a specific number. |
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R H Draney
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 10:27 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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Dylan Nicholson filted:
| Quote: |
"Maria Conlon" <mariaconlon001@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2v0112F2euqe0U1@uni-berlin.de...
But: When asked if I own a house, I would answer "yes" even if I own
more than one. "A house" would just signal "at least one house" to me.
Same's true for car. The difference is "a" rather than a specific number.
|
Somewhere, G E Moore is smiling seraphically, as was his wont....r |
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Freddy
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:15 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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"R H Draney" <dadoctah@spamcop.net> wrote in message
news:cmerv30l01@drn.newsguy.com...
| Quote: | Dylan Nicholson filted:
"Maria Conlon" <mariaconlon001@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2v0112F2euqe0U1@uni-berlin.de...
But: When asked if I own a house, I would answer "yes" even if I own
more than one. "A house" would just signal "at least one house" to me.
Same's true for car. The difference is "a" rather than a specific number.
Somewhere, G E Moore is smiling seraphically, as was his wont....r
|
I'd like to borrow some money. Anyone got five dollars? |
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don groves
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 12:23 pm
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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In article <2v0112F2euqe0U1@uni-berlin.de>, Maria Conlon at
mariaconlon001@hotmail.com poured forth...
| Quote: | don groves wrote:
Skitt poured forth...
don groves rakstija:
Skitt poured forth...
Donna Richoux rakstija:
mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance,
I admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to
post it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who
knows about one of the cars only and one day finds out about
another. Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile
one and is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies
it with the full statement. "No, I have three."
Just "yes" or "no", please! ;-)
I've often wondered what would happen if a witness so instructed
replied "I cannot answer that question "yes" or "no" within the
bounds of the oath I just took."
For example Q: "Do you own a house?" Suppose I own two houses.
Does "a" in this question mean "one", or does it mean "any".
Without knowing that, I can't truthfully answer either way.
Well, when restricted to a "yes" or "no" answer, I'd choose the one
that was more advantageous to my cause, and let them *try* to prove
perjury if they thought I had committed it.
Yes, probably the better course.
Although it might be fun to answer the way I did above and force
the prosecutor to ask a more specific or better worded question,
possibly embarrassing him/her in the process. That strategy would
depend on how twitchy I thought judge's contempt trigger was.
The original poster, Mike Morgan, wondered if he could answer both "yes"
and "no" to a question and still be telling the truth (about having
three cars when asked if he had two). I would propose answering "Yes and
no" -- those three words -- to questions like that. Even in court, it
seems that that would bring about another question, the answer to which
could clear up the matter.
|
An answer of "Yes and no" would bring an immediate objection
because you were instructed to answer "yes" or "no".
| Quote: | But: When asked if I own a house, I would answer "yes" even if I own
more than one. "A house" would just signal "at least one house" to me.
Maria Conlon
|
--
dg (domain=ccwebster) |
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John O'Flaherty
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 8:47 pm
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
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don groves wrote:
| Quote: | In article <2v0112F2euqe0U1@uni-berlin.de>, Maria Conlon at
mariaconlon001@hotmail.com poured forth...
don groves wrote:
Skitt poured forth...
don groves rakstija:
Skitt poured forth...
Donna Richoux rakstija:
mike morgan wrote:
The matter I'm about to introduce is of a doubtful significance,
I admit, but it's been bugging me for so long that I decided to
post it.
Suppose there's a guy who has 3 cars. He's got a friend, who
knows about one of the cars only and one day finds out about
another. Quite surprised he asks: -Do you have 2 cars?
And now what I want to know. Can the owner answer both "yes" and
"no" and still be telling the truth?
If he says Yes, what he says is true, but it is not what is called
"the whole truth." That's why the oath you swear in court is to do
more than merely "tell the truth."
A problem occurs when the witness is designated as being a hostile
one and is restricted to strictly "yes" and "no" answers.
If he says No, he is not telling the truth, unless he accompanies
it with the full statement. "No, I have three."
Just "yes" or "no", please! ;-)
I've often wondered what would happen if a witness so instructed
replied "I cannot answer that question "yes" or "no" within the
bounds of the oath I just took."
For example Q: "Do you own a house?" Suppose I own two houses.
Does "a" in this question mean "one", or does it mean "any".
Without knowing that, I can't truthfully answer either way.
Well, when restricted to a "yes" or "no" answer, I'd choose the one
that was more advantageous to my cause, and let them *try* to prove
perjury if they thought I had committed it.
Yes, probably the better course.
Although it might be fun to answer the way I did above and force
the prosecutor to ask a more specific or better worded question,
possibly embarrassing him/her in the process. That strategy would
depend on how twitchy I thought judge's contempt trigger was.
The original poster, Mike Morgan, wondered if he could answer both "yes"
and "no" to a question and still be telling the truth (about having
three cars when asked if he had two). I would propose answering "Yes and
no" -- those three words -- to questions like that. Even in court, it
seems that that would bring about another question, the answer to which
could clear up the matter.
An answer of "Yes and no" would bring an immediate objection
because you were instructed to answer "yes" or "no".
|
Then say "yes or no, depending".
I wonder: can a witness turn to the judge and ask for clarification, or
would that pull the trigger? Do you have to be one of the lawyers to
address the judge?
--
john |
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Donna Richoux
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 9:16 pm
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
|
|
John O'Flaherty <quiasmox@yahoo.com> wrote:
[snip discussion of "yes" and "no" answers in court]
| Quote: | Then say "yes or no, depending".
|
I think people have exaggerated in their minds how far an interrogating
lawyer can go in insisting on "yes" or "no" answers only.
What you've sworn to do is tell the truth. You have not sworn to utter
nothing but "y-e-s" and "n-o". Therefore any reasonable, polite effort
you make to uphold your duty to tell the truth is going to be allowed,
within limits.
The FindLaw website has a page of advice on giving testimony.
http://library.lp.findlaw.com/articles/file/00887/000447/title/Subject/t
opic/Civil%20Procedure_Evidence%20and%20Witnesses/filename/civilprocedur
e_2_755
It says, among other things:
Never guess at an answer.
If you don't know, say so.
[Right there, that violates "yes or no only"]
Answer only the question asked; do it directly; do
not "suggest" the next question.
Give short answers where possible. Stop when answer
is over; do not continue talking merely because
opposing counsel pauses; just wait for the next
question.
Yes or no answers are best of all (but do not give
yes or no answers where they are not appropriate no
matter how much insisted on by the questioner).
Insist on long answers where necessary.
| Quote: |
I wonder: can a witness turn to the judge and ask for clarification, or
would that pull the trigger? Do you have to be one of the lawyers to
address the judge?
|
I've seen characters in courtroom dramas address the judge in extreme
circumstances. If you preface it with "Your Honor" and have a reasonable
concern, is the judge going to toss you out of the room?
--
Best -- Donna Richoux |
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Maria Conlon
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 2:05 am
Post subject: Re: 'yes' and/or 'no' ? |
|
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don groves wrote:
| Quote: | Maria Conlon poured forth...
[...]
The original poster, Mike Morgan, wondered if he could answer both
"yes" and "no" to a question and still be telling the truth (about
having three cars when asked if he had two). I would propose
answering "Yes and no" -- those three words -- to questions like
that. Even in court, it seems that that would bring about another
question, the answer to which could clear up the matter.
An answer of "Yes and no" would bring an immediate objection
because you were instructed to answer "yes" or "no".
|
The part about answering with a "Yes" or a "No" only was an add-on to
the original question, and I wonder if such instructions are given in
Real Life courts these days. Anyone know? (In the actual court
situations I've seen, no such restriction has ever been made.)
Maria Conlon |
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