Nesh
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Nesh
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Phil C.
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Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 9:19 pm    Post subject: Nesh Reply with quote

Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.
--
Phil C.
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David
Guest





Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 9:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

According to the big one, it's from OE nescian and connected to modern
Flemish, neschen, to wet.

Earliest reference provided c. 897., latest 1471.

Three meanings given. 1. intr. to become soft, obs.; 2. trans. to make
soft, obs.; 3. dial. with it. to turn faint-hearted (to funk it).

Also Neshhead, Neshly & Neshness.


--
http://www.dacha.freeuk.com/photo/0z02-0.htm
High Force
The Northern boundary of old Yorkshire
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Phil C.
Guest





Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 9:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 14:19:14 +0000, Phil C.
<philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote:

Quote:
Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

Did I really write its and it's in the same paragraph? Obviously an
imposter or a typo. I have established, though, that "nesh" didn't
extend as far down as north Northants. I've never heard it Lincs and
can't find it in Lincolnshire Dialects by G. Edward Campion, 1976.

I think it was Lenin, by the way, who said that any author who doesn't
include an index should be shot - wise words. Watch out G. Edward
Campion.
--
Phil C.
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Dave Fawthrop
Guest





Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 14:19:14 +0000, Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net>
wrote:

| Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
| Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
| meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
| it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
| it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
| and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.
|
| It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
| Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
| mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
| obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
| reliable source for etymologies).
|
| Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
| becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
| can't think of an obvious synonym.

It is also a Yorkshire dialect word which I recognized immediately.

It is in The Yorkshire Dictionary by Arnold Kellett with much the same
meaning. Derivation (Old English nesc)
--
Dave F
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mUs1Ka
Guest





Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

Phil C. wrote:
Quote:
Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

Definitely a dialect word from my youth, in Shropshire and one I still use
occasionally.
--
Ray
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Phil C.
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 12:50 am    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 16:51:20 +0000 (GMT), David
<david@dacha.freeuk.com> wrote:

Quote:
In article <vl6qu0907s63csajeqmd5cld5nhsscnfr7@4ax.com>,
Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote:
Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

According to the big one, it's from OE nescian and connected to modern
Flemish, neschen, to wet.

Earliest reference provided c. 897., latest 1471.

Three meanings given. 1. intr. to become soft, obs.; 2. trans. to make
soft, obs.; 3. dial. with it. to turn faint-hearted (to funk it).

Also Neshhead, Neshly & Neshness.

Thanks. Did its use an adjective elude them? I wonder if it survived
for centuries without being written down or if it's a more modern
re-introduction to various dialects with a more specific meaning. The
areas where its found don't seem to match OE dialect areas - a mixture
of some Mercian and some Northumbrian(?)
--
Phil C.
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Giles Todd
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:22 am    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 17:50:48 +0000, Phil C.
<philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote:

Quote:
Thanks. Did its use an adjective elude them?

No. Viz (citations omitted):

Forms: a. 1 hnesce, (hnysce, hnisce; nesc, næsc), 2 nexce, neche, 3–5
nesche, nesshe, 4 ness(ss)e, 4–5 nessche, 5–6 neshe; 4–5 nesch,
ness(h, 5– nesh. b. 3 neys(se, 4– 5 neische, -sshe, neysshe, (5
-ssche, neyshe), 4 neisch, -ssh, 5 neysch(e, naysch(e, 9 dial. naish,
U.S. dial. nish. c. 5 nassh(e, 6 Sc. nasche, 7, 9 nash, 8 gnash. [OE.
hnesce, = Du. (16th c.) nesch, nisch soft (of eggs), damp, sodden,
foolish, Goth. hnasqus soft, tender; the ultimate etym. is unknown.]

1. a. Soft in texture or consistency; yielding easily to pressure
or force; in later use esp. tender, succulent, juicy.

†b. transf. Not harsh or violent. Obs. rare.

c. Damp, moist, wet. rare.

2. a. Slack, negligent; lacking in energy or diligence.

b. Timid; wanting in courage; faint-hearted.

†3. a. Tender, mild, gentle, kind; inclined to pity, mercy, or
other tender feelings. Obs.

†b. Easily yielding to temptation; inclined to lust or wantonness.
Obs.

4. a. Tender, delicate, weak; unable to endure fatigue or exposure;
susceptible to cold.
The most prevalent sense in mod. dialect use.

b. Dainty, fastidious, squeamish.

†5. absol. (usually in conjunction with hard.) a. That which is
soft; soft ground; also pl. of persons (quot. c1330). Obs.

†b. Mild or gentle treatment. Obs.

†c. in nesh and hard, etc., under all or any circumstances. Obs.

†d. So for nesh or hard, etc. Obs.

†6. adv. Softly, gently, tenderly. Obs. rare.

Giles.
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Robin Bignall
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:25 am    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 16:48:39 -0000, "mUs1Ka" <mUs1Ka@exite.com> wrote:

Quote:
Phil C. wrote:
Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

Definitely a dialect word from my youth, in Shropshire and one I still use
occasionally.

It was slightly pejorative in my youth in Nottingham. Nesh kids were
also prone to be mardy - sulky and whining.
Both words are in COD10.

--

wrmst rgrds
Robin Bignall

Hertfordshire
England
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David
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 11:07 am    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

In article <i46ru0h3o5n9j7q7e4si0r6k96esckfqdg@4ax.com>,
Giles Todd <g@prullenbak.todd.nu> wrote:
Quote:
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 17:50:48 +0000, Phil C.
philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote:

Thanks. Did its use an adjective elude them?

No. Viz (citations omitted):

[Snip]

Oops! Mea culpa. I've got the two volume Compact Edition (4 pages
reduced per page) and my sight isn't as good as it used to be (when I
bought it in the early 70s, I hardly ever required the magnifying glass
provided); I saw the verb entry on page 98 and totally failed to see
the preceding adjectival and adverbial entries beginning on page 97.

I could offer in mitigation the Anglo-Saxon (OE) references from
Bosworth & Toller but as they're generally the same meanings as
provided by Giles from the OED, there's not much point.


--
http://www.dacha.freeuk.com/ -- Dacha's Digital Domicile

"Americans . . ." muttered Otto, "softly dropping their turds wherever they go." ~ Paula Fox: Desperate Characters.
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K. Edgcombe
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

In article <354svbF4fek4eU1@individual.net>, mUs1Ka <mUs1Ka@exite.com> wrote:
Quote:
Phil C. wrote:

Definitely a dialect word from my youth, in Shropshire and one I still use
occasionally.

It's a normal part of my vocabulary (London, but my parents came from
Yorkshire).

Katy
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Laura F. Spira
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

Robin Bignall wrote:

Quote:
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 16:48:39 -0000, "mUs1Ka" <mUs1Ka@exite.com> wrote:


Phil C. wrote:

Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

Definitely a dialect word from my youth, in Shropshire and one I still use
occasionally.


It was slightly pejorative in my youth in Nottingham. Nesh kids were
also prone to be mardy - sulky and whining.

Not surprising if they were feeling parky.

Quote:
Both words are in COD10.



--
Laura
(emulate St. George for email)
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Phil C.
Guest





Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 7:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 23:25:05 +0000, Robin Bignall
<docrobin@ntlworld.com> wrote:

Quote:
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 16:48:39 -0000, "mUs1Ka" <mUs1Ka@exite.com> wrote:

Phil C. wrote:
Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

Definitely a dialect word from my youth, in Shropshire and one I still use
occasionally.

It was slightly pejorative in my youth in Nottingham. Nesh kids were
also prone to be mardy - sulky and whining.
Both words are in COD10.

"Mardy" was also used in N. Staffs. A baby who wasn't mardy was
described as "pleasant". Hardly a dialect word, but it was a very
specific usage. My son was frequently described as a "pleasant baby".
--
Phil C.
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Giles Todd
Guest





Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 7:58 am    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 12:13:02 +0000, Phil C.
<philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote:

Quote:
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 23:25:05 +0000, Robin Bignall
docrobin@ntlworld.com> wrote:

It was slightly pejorative in my youth in Nottingham. Nesh kids were
also prone to be mardy - sulky and whining.
Both words are in COD10.

"Mardy" was also used in N. Staffs. A baby who wasn't mardy was
described as "pleasant". Hardly a dialect word, but it was a very
specific usage. My son was frequently described as a "pleasant baby".

"Mardy" was often in use in Leicester in the 1960s ("mardy-arse" was a
common primary school playground insult). I don't remember hearing
"nesh" until much later when I was living further north, though.

Giles.
--
Just don't ask, OK? You won't like me when I sulk.
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Phil C.
Guest





Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 6:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 01:58:29 +0100, Giles Todd <g@prullenbak.todd.nu>
wrote:

Quote:
"Mardy" was often in use in Leicester in the 1960s ("mardy-arse" was a
common primary school playground insult). I don't remember hearing
"nesh" until much later when I was living further north, though.

"Mardy" was also common in Northants.
--
Phil C.
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Robin Bignall
Guest





Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 5:45 am    Post subject: Re: Nesh Reply with quote

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 11:41:34 +0000, "Laura F. Spira"
<laura@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> wrote:

Quote:
Robin Bignall wrote:

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 16:48:39 -0000, "mUs1Ka" <mUs1Ka@exite.com> wrote:


Phil C. wrote:

Today I heard the word "nesh" used by an East Midlands (i.e.
Nottingham) regional news presenter as a mildly pejorative term
meaning "prone to feeling the cold". It was the first time I've heard
it since I lived in North Staffs (1970s). A quick web search suggests
it's also seen as a dialect word of Yorks, Lancs, Cheshire, Cumbria
and mid Wales, though in some areas it just means soft.

It's not in COD (9th) but does seem to appear in 10th, acording to a
Googled comment on another NG. The only dictionary I have which
mentions it is the Imperial Dictionary of 1850 which gives it as an
obsolete term meaning soft, tender, nice from AS "nesc". (Not a
reliable source for etymologies).

Does anybody know more about its origin? I wonder if it's use is
becoming more widespread - it is a genuinely useful term for which I
can't think of an obvious synonym.

Definitely a dialect word from my youth, in Shropshire and one I still use
occasionally.


It was slightly pejorative in my youth in Nottingham. Nesh kids were
also prone to be mardy - sulky and whining.

Not surprising if they were feeling parky.

Both words are in COD10.

Nippy out, isn't it.


--

wrmst rgrds
Robin Bignall

Hertfordshire
England
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