| Author |
Message |
Joe Fineman
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:24 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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R H Draney <dadoctah@spamcop.net> writes:
| Quote: | And then there was the famous Scottish actor who appeared on
Jeopardy and insisted on reading one of the category titles as "The
Rapists"....r
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That is said to have happened by accident to Leo Rosten: he began an
article in _Look_ magazine with the words "As therapists are well
aware,..." and was horrified at what appeared in print.
--
--- Joe Fineman joe_f@verizon.net
||: Too lively, and you're dead.  | |
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Michael Hamm
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:27 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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Today, Robt E <yahoo@robt_englund.com> gosled:
| Quote: | I grew up in a German/Scandinavian community. My instructors in both
Latin and Greek used "German" pronunciations for the Latin and Greek
vowels and diphthongs. "Ei" was sounded as in "heist", "au" as in
"haus/house", etc.
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Do you mean to say that you pronounce 'house' and 'haus' the same?
Michael Hamm
AM, Math, Wash. U. St. Louis
msh210@math.wustl.edu Fine print:
http://math.wustl.edu/~msh210/ ... legal.html |
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Joe Fineman
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:39 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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"lightbulb" <lightbulb@chartermi.net> writes:
| Quote: | "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs4i36$aak$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
Michael J Hardy wrote:
Adrian Bailey (dadge@hotmail.com) wrote:
And FWIW, I thought it was tit-liced too until very recently.
Is that because you had never really paid attention to the spelling?
MWCD has "titlist" as a "title holder." The Titleist company
probably added the "e" to keep people from saying TIT-list.
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Or, perhaps, to make it easier to defend as a trade name.
Also, the vulgar are in general more skittish than the lexicographers
with regard to the rule for dropping silent e before a suffix,
particularly when the word is short & might seem disguised on
shortening it further. One often sees such spellings as "ageing" &
"mileage" even among people who have mostly assimilated the rule. In
the case of "titleist" an additional motive might be to suggest a
three-syllable pronunciation (which the AHD gives as an alternative,
and which comes natural to me). Cf. "simplest", which I used to
pronounce in three syllables when I was little.
--
--- Joe Fineman joe_f@verizon.net
||: The dirt in the cracks is where life goes on. | |
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John Dean
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:42 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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lightbulb wrote:
| Quote: | "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs4i36$aak$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
Michael J Hardy wrote:
Adrian Bailey (dadge@hotmail.com) wrote:
And FWIW, I thought it was tit-liced too until very recently.
Is that because you had never really paid attention to the spelling?
MWCD has "titlist" as a "title holder." The Titleist company
probably added the "e" to keep people from saying TIT-list.
|
Didn't work, did it?
As for spelling, there's nothing there intrinsically to mandate one
pronunciation over the other.
Next week - Titian.
--
John Dean
Oxford |
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Django Cat
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 11:09 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 09:53:22 -0500, "Witziges Rätsel" <zer@roer.com>
wrote:
| Quote: | I believe the Chrysler Nova story has already been debunked by Spanish
speakers in these hallowed pages.
If I recall correctly, it was a Chevrolet Nova, not a Chrysler.
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To be honest, where I live it's a Vauxhall Nova, I'm just trying to be
pluralist. <google></google> Yup, you're quite right.
DC |
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lightbulb
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 11:40 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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"Joe Fineman" <joe_f@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:uu0plcpc6.fsf@verizon.net...
| Quote: | "lightbulb" <lightbulb@chartermi.net> writes:
"John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs4i36$aak$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
Michael J Hardy wrote:
Adrian Bailey (dadge@hotmail.com) wrote:
And FWIW, I thought it was tit-liced too until very recently.
Is that because you had never really paid attention to the spelling?
MWCD has "titlist" as a "title holder." The Titleist company
probably added the "e" to keep people from saying TIT-list.
Or, perhaps, to make it easier to defend as a trade name.
Also, the vulgar are in general more skittish than the lexicographers
with regard to the rule for dropping silent e before a suffix,
particularly when the word is short & might seem disguised on
shortening it further. One often sees such spellings as "ageing" &
"mileage" even among people who have mostly assimilated the rule. In
the case of "titleist" an additional motive might be to suggest a
three-syllable pronunciation (which the AHD gives as an alternative,
and which comes natural to me). Cf. "simplest", which I used to
pronounce in three syllables when I was little.
|
MWCD has "simplest" in two or three syllables as well. SIM-plist seems
hurried, but I'm sure I use it too. I can't find "titleist" in the AHD (as
an alternative or anything else), so I assume you're referring to "titlist"
having three syllables. I agree. TI-tle-ist. I have no idea how anybody
got TIT-lice-est, though. From where does that "ce" come?
As I kid I always tried to force the word to be TIT-li-est, as in having
the most tits (I'm not sure why the number of tits was funny, but Titleist
doesn't give one much with which to work). It was less of a hang-up than
trying to figure a good joke about "Pass With Care," as that damn "e" always
seemed to ruin a good joke. Had I been a vandal, I would have painted
over it. I have always found "Pass With Car" to be funny due to the comical
image of somebody jumping out of their car and <running> around the
offending slow traffic. I now have a scar on my brain from compulsively
trying to figure out how "Car E" can be funny. Signs, signs, everywhere.
Mike |
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Evan Kirshenbaum
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 11:45 pm
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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mhamm@artsci.wustl.edu (Michael Hamm) writes:
| Quote: | To me, "knock-off" is a noun meaning some thing like "something
meant to imitate another", so that an Allen Sherman song might be a
knock-off of[1] the Marseillaise and Glad's sealable, reuseable,
microwav(e?)able containers are a knock-off on[1] Rubbermaid's.
[1] Notice both "of" and "on". "Of" more formally. In fact,
"take-off" more formally than "knock-off".
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Those aren't the same to me. A Sherman song is a "take-off" (or, more
likely, a parody[1]), but not a "knock-off". To me, a knock-off has
to be (1) less expensive than the original and (2) intended to be
indistinguishable from the original, at least under cursory
inspection. For a song, it would have to be a cover close enough that
people could be fooled into thinking it was the original.
[1] "Weird Al" Yankovic's liner notes distinguish between "parodies"
and "lyric adaptations", the latter being used, for example, for
"The Saga Begins", a take-off on "American Pie". The parodies
seem to poke fun at the song itself, while the "lyric adaptations"
(at least that one) use the tune but poke fun at something else.
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories |Marge: You liked Rashomon.
1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |Homer: That's not how *I* remember
Palo Alto, CA 94304 | it.
kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com
(650)857-7572
http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ |
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lightbulb
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 12:04 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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"John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs68b5$jt$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
| Quote: | lightbulb wrote:
"John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs4i36$aak$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
Michael J Hardy wrote:
Adrian Bailey (dadge@hotmail.com) wrote:
And FWIW, I thought it was tit-liced too until very recently.
Is that because you had never really paid attention to the spelling?
MWCD has "titlist" as a "title holder." The Titleist company
probably added the "e" to keep people from saying TIT-list.
Didn't work, did it?
No, but it is hard to distract someone who is determined to see a tit |
regardless of the context.
| Quote: | As for spelling, there's nothing there intrinsically to mandate one
pronunciation over the other.
|
Perhaps we have an accent issue. To me, Titleist has no way of containing
"liced." I am confused by the number of people who seem to see "liced" in
Titleist. Breaking the word down into Tit- and -leist and using a sitcomish
German accent could result in what would seem to be a lot of extra work. In
context of the word, I can't see -leist as rhyming with "heist." I do not,
in fact, even see -leist when it is in Titleist. That is probably due to my
lack of exposure to any foreign language but Spanish, which has since lost
most of its effect on me. In a different post to this thread I admit my
earlier, and at the time funnier, interpretation of Titleist.
| Quote: | Next week - Titian.
|
I hesitate...but cannot resist.
Titian: Of or relating to a sixteenth century Italian painter's
brownish-orange breasts
Mike |
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Evan Kirshenbaum
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 12:17 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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Joe Fineman <joe_f@verizon.net> writes:
| Quote: | "lightbulb" <lightbulb@chartermi.net> writes:
"John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs4i36$aak$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
Michael J Hardy wrote:
Adrian Bailey (dadge@hotmail.com) wrote:
And FWIW, I thought it was tit-liced too until very recently.
Is that because you had never really paid attention to the spelling?
MWCD has "titlist" as a "title holder." The Titleist company
probably added the "e" to keep people from saying TIT-list.
Or, perhaps, to make it easier to defend as a trade name.
|
The official explanation doesn't actually explain the spelling:
The origin of the name Titleist is not widely understood, but once
you know, it seems so obvious! It is an American word used to
describe "the one who wins the title", much as we use finalist or
medalist. We think it is a very fitting name!
http://www.intheswing.info/viewCampaign.asp?id=75
It may have been a variant spelling back in 1935, when the balls first
came out, though. From ProQuest, I find
April, the eastern month of "showers and flowers"--mostly
showers--will witness the golfing coronation of two major
champions, starting with the amateur winning through to the
Sourthern California championship in the event starting at the
California club, Tuesday, the sixth day of next month and
concluding when numerical figures for 72 holes have nominated a
titleist in the California State open event at the El Caballero
club, not quite two weeks later.
George Von Elm, _Los Angeles Times_, March 28, 1926.
There are two other hits in the _Times_, but they may be spurious, so
it's possible that this one is a typo. (There are 891 hits for
"titlist".)
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories |As the judge remarked the day that
1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 | he acquitted my Aunt Hortense,
Palo Alto, CA 94304 |To be smut
|It must be ut-
kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |Terly without redeeming social
(650)857-7572 | importance.
| Tom Lehrer
http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ |
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R H Draney
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:04 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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lightbulb filted:
| Quote: |
As I kid I always tried to force the word to be TIT-li-est, as in having
the most tits (I'm not sure why the number of tits was funny, but Titleist
doesn't give one much with which to work).
|
Titly, titlier, titliest...it's just too bad that it's i before e except after
seven-thirty, six-thirty central time....
| Quote: | It was less of a hang-up than
trying to figure a good joke about "Pass With Care," as that damn "e" always
seemed to ruin a good joke. Had I been a vandal, I would have painted
over it. I have always found "Pass With Car" to be funny due to the comical
image of somebody jumping out of their car and <running> around the
offending slow traffic. I now have a scar on my brain from compulsively
trying to figure out how "Car E" can be funny. Signs, signs, everywhere.
|
How about the hot-air hand dryers in public washrooms?...I can't begin to count
the number of plates I've seen that have been scratched to change the
instructions from:
(1) Push button
(2) Rub hands under warm air
(3) Stops automatically
to
(1) Push butt
(2) Rub hands under arm
(3) Stops a tom ically
This is so consistent I wonder if there was once a mass-media presentation of
just how to alter the words....
And then there's "employees must wash hands"...hey, my turkey melt is out there
getting cold and I have to wait here in the gents for some employee to come
along and wash my hands for me?...r |
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John Dean
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:17 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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lightbulb wrote:
| Quote: | "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs68b5$jt$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
lightbulb wrote:
"John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:cs4i36$aak$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
Michael J Hardy wrote:
Adrian Bailey (dadge@hotmail.com) wrote:
And FWIW, I thought it was tit-liced too until very recently.
Is that because you had never really paid attention to the spelling?
MWCD has "titlist" as a "title holder." The Titleist company
probably added the "e" to keep people from saying TIT-list.
Didn't work, did it?
No, but it is hard to distract someone who is determined to see a tit
regardless of the context.
As for spelling, there's nothing there intrinsically to mandate one
pronunciation over the other.
Perhaps we have an accent issue. To me, Titleist has no way of
containing "liced." I am confused by the number of people who seem
to see "liced" in Titleist. Breaking the word down into Tit- and
-leist and using a sitcomish German accent could result in what would
seem to be a lot of extra work. In context of the word, I can't see
-leist as rhyming with "heist." I do not, in fact, even see -leist
when it is in Titleist. That is probably due to my lack of exposure
to any foreign language but Spanish, which has since lost most of its
effect on me.
|
You don't need to know other languages, but if you know some of the
world's famous names you might be led in the direction of leist <rhymes>
with heist. Kleist, frinstance, one of the most celebrated of German
dramatists.
English has taken in words with the 'eist' pronounced 'iced' ending -
like Zeitgeist and poltergeist.
| Quote: |
Next week - Titian.
I hesitate...but cannot resist.
Titian: Of or relating to a sixteenth century Italian painter's
brownish-orange breasts
|
I was more interested in what you might regard as possible and
impossible pronunciations of Titian.
--
John Dean
Oxford |
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Steve Hayes
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:19 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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On 12 Jan 2005 21:53:44 -0800, R H Draney <dadoctah@spamcop.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Steve Hayes filted:
There was a patent remedy advertised on the radio here a few years ago. GThey
called it "Karl Metz". It was only years later that I discovered that the name
of the product was actually "Calmettes".
It was pronouncing the "l" that confused me, and I'd never have found the
product if I was actually wanting to buy it.
Nice...for a while, there was a radio ad for something to treat cold sores...but
someone at the ad agency decided the voice had to have "character", so they came
up with some fake blue-collar New Jersey accent to read the copy...if I hadn't
already seen the product's name in print, I might have tried looking for
something called "Oipasin L" instead of "Herpecin L"....
|
Oh, is it people from New Joisey who say "Toity poiple boids..."?
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk |
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Michael Hamm
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:49 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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Today, Michael J Hardy <mjhardy@mit.edu> gosled:
| Quote: | Do you mean to say that you pronounce 'house' and 'haus' the same?
Yes, that is standard.
|
Hm. I don't know German, so perhaps I'm simply mispronouncing 'Haus'[1],
but I pronounce it /haws/ and 'house' /h&ws/.
[1] Thanks for the spelling correction, btw.
Michael Hamm
AM, Math, Wash. U. St. Louis
msh210@math.wustl.edu Fine print:
http://math.wustl.edu/~msh210/ ... legal.html |
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the Omrud
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:45 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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Steve Hayes typed thusly:
| Quote: | On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 00:29:46 GMT, Tony Cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net
wrote:
On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 23:13:26 +0000, "Laura F. Spira"
laura@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> wrote:
Wouldn't you say "knock it off" if you meant desist? "Knock off" round
here means stolen.
"Knock off" round here means a copy of something. A dress that looks
like a Versace, but isn't, is a knock-off.
Like all these R'olex'es people are wanting to sell me nowadays.
|
Why are they trying to sell us fake Rolexes for $170 or some such
amount? If I buy a fake Rolex, I want it to cost £4.99
--
David
====replace usenet with the |
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the Omrud
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:49 am
Post subject: Re: It took 20 yrs but... |
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Django Cat typed thusly:
| Quote: | On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 09:53:22 -0500, "Witziges Rätsel" <zer@roer.com
wrote:
I believe the Chrysler Nova story has already been debunked by Spanish
speakers in these hallowed pages.
If I recall correctly, it was a Chevrolet Nova, not a Chrysler.
To be honest, where I live it's a Vauxhall Nova, I'm just trying to be
pluralist. <google></google> Yup, you're quite right.
|
Having bought Daewoo, GM is now changing the brand on Daewoo cars to
Chevrolet. At least in the UK, where the Chevrolet brand hasn't been
used before (or not much, at any rate).
--
David
====replace usenet with the |
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