| Author |
Message |
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:05 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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Arcadian Rises wrote:
| Quote: | In many languages with gramatical gender, when the subject is
masculin, |
Do you mean grammatically masculine, or that the person represented by
the noun is masculine by sex?
| Quote: | everything else (pronouns, adjectives) flexes to masculine, so the
gender
deprivation of a woman is more obvious than "the postman and her
bag". |
So, then, the fact that speakers of these languages have a lifetime of
awareness that grammatical gender is pretty much arbitrary does not
minimize this effect when the sex of the subject is not the same as the
gender of the noun?
| Quote: | When refering to herself (i.e. "I am a good actor") the gender
deprivation o
is even more obvious.
|
Do you mean in English? If so, I can't see how there is any gender
deprivation unless you assume that the -or ending marks the subject as
masculine/male. But you may be using "actor" simply as an illustration
by analogy in English of an effect in gendered languages.
Gary Williams
Gary Williams |
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Charles Riggs
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:06 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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On Sun, 5 Dec 2004 12:05:16 -0800, don groves <dgroves@domain.net>
wrote:
| Quote: | In article <31h4toF3c3a07U1@individual.net>, Jess Askin at
dontbother@nospam.net exposited:
"irwell" <hook@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:oje4r0tt5a30i5a58a96cbg3esdrd1hdci@4ax.com...
The French seem to use Senatrice.
I believe Hillary Clinton prefers Senatrix.
Will she become the party whip?
|
Would Hillary tie our hands? She is the one who needs to be
restrained, ya know, or else the Democratic candidate for president in
2008, if she's to be that, will lose bigger time than the one in 2004
did, I predict.
--
Charles Riggs
They are no accented letters in my email address |
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Arcadian Rises
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:08 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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| Quote: | From: williamsg4713@juno.com
Arcadian Rises wrote:
In many languages with gramatical gender, when the subject is
masculin,
Do you mean grammatically masculine, or that the person represented by
the noun is masculine by sex?
|
Both.
| Quote: | everything else (pronouns, adjectives) flexes to masculine, so the
gender
deprivation of a woman is more obvious than "the postman and her
bag".
So, then, the fact that speakers of these languages have a lifetime of
awareness that grammatical gender is pretty much arbitrary does not
minimize this effect when the sex of the subject is not the same as the
gender of the noun?
|
They become aware later in life of the randomness of the gramatical gender.
Until then, a child "knows" that e.g. the dog is male, like the sky, the desk,
the knife or his father; a cat is female, like the doll, the shirt, blouse, the
country, or his sister.
| Quote: | When refering to herself (i.e. "I am a good actor") the gender
deprivation o
is even more obvious.
Do you mean in English?
|
No.
| Quote: | If so, I can't see how there is any gender
deprivation unless you assume that the -or ending marks the subject as
masculine/male. But you may be using "actor" simply as an illustration
by analogy in English of an effect in gendered languages.
|
When I say (in French or Italian) " I'm a good actor", I have to flex "good" at
masculin, accordingly. In some languages even the "I" gets flexed accordingly. |
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irwell
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:11 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 09:41:46 -0800, Charles Riggs <chriggs@comcást.net> wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 5 Dec 2004 12:05:16 -0800, don groves <dgroves@domain.net
wrote:
In article <31h4toF3c3a07U1@individual.net>, Jess Askin at
dontbother@nospam.net exposited:
"irwell" <hook@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:oje4r0tt5a30i5a58a96cbg3esdrd1hdci@4ax.com...
The French seem to use Senatrice.
I believe Hillary Clinton prefers Senatrix.
Will she become the party whip?
Would Hillary tie our hands? She is the one who needs to be
restrained, ya know, or else the Democratic candidate for president in
2008, if she's to be that, will lose bigger time than the one in 2004
did, I predict.
Depends a lot on what happens under the Bush |
second term, an Iraq disater or even worse. |
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Paul Wolff
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:11 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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|
In message <20041206125206.06084.00000902@mb-m19.aol.com>, Arcadian
Rises <arcadianrises@aol.com> writes
| Quote: | From: williamsg4713@juno.com
So, then, the fact that speakers of these languages have a lifetime of
awareness that grammatical gender is pretty much arbitrary does not
minimize this effect when the sex of the subject is not the same as the
gender of the noun?
They become aware later in life of the randomness of the gramatical gender.
Until then, a child "knows" that e.g. the dog is male, like the sky, the desk,
the knife or his father; a cat is female, like the doll, the shirt, blouse, the
country, or his sister.
I doubt that the child "knows" that the shirt is female any more than I |
as a child "knew" that a ship was female. I knew that a ship had no
sex. It seems much more probable that the child simply knows that the
shirt word is always used with inflexions that a large proportion of
other words are used with, including the majority (in some languages,
not all) of words marking females.
--
Paul
In bocca al Lupo! |
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don groves
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:12 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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In article <jt59r058e7ftqbejls4a4d8iv36b3naq7a@4ax.com>, Charles
Riggs at chriggs@comcást.net exposited:
| Quote: | On Sun, 5 Dec 2004 12:05:16 -0800, don groves <dgroves@domain.net
wrote:
In article <31h4toF3c3a07U1@individual.net>, Jess Askin at
dontbother@nospam.net exposited:
"irwell" <hook@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:oje4r0tt5a30i5a58a96cbg3esdrd1hdci@4ax.com...
The French seem to use Senatrice.
I believe Hillary Clinton prefers Senatrix.
Will she become the party whip?
Would Hillary tie our hands? She is the one who needs to be
restrained, ya know, or else the Democratic candidate for president in
2008, if she's to be that, will lose bigger time than the one in 2004
did, I predict.
|
I agree. I doubt she'll even run but have greater doubt she
could be elected.
--
dg (domain=ccwebster) |
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Charles Riggs
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 12:03 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
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On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 13:04:07 -0800, irwell <hook@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 09:41:46 -0800, Charles Riggs <chriggs@comcást.net> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Dec 2004 12:05:16 -0800, don groves <dgroves@domain.net
wrote:
In article <31h4toF3c3a07U1@individual.net>, Jess Askin at
dontbother@nospam.net exposited:
"irwell" <hook@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:oje4r0tt5a30i5a58a96cbg3esdrd1hdci@4ax.com...
The French seem to use Senatrice.
I believe Hillary Clinton prefers Senatrix.
Will she become the party whip?
Would Hillary tie our hands? She is the one who needs to be
restrained, ya know, or else the Democratic candidate for president in
2008, if she's to be that, will lose bigger time than the one in 2004
did, I predict.
Depends a lot on what happens under the Bush
second term, an Iraq disater or even worse.
|
No, no, I wasn't saying a Democrat couldn't win, I was saying Hillary
couldn't. American men wouldn't tolerate a Maggie, as their British
cousins did for a while. That returns us to Don's comment, since
dominatrixs handy with the whip were popularized by the English. That
style of sadomasochistic behavior is termed "English culture", or
something much like it, for that reason.
--
Charles Riggs
They are no accented letters in my email address |
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don groves
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 6:05 am
Post subject: Re: Female Senator. |
|
|
In article <9jubr01hirgm8kr4pk42v3mnftenqp124r@4ax.com>, Charles
Riggs at chriggs@comcást.net exposited:
| Quote: | On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 13:04:07 -0800, irwell <hook@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 09:41:46 -0800, Charles Riggs <chriggs@comcást.net> wrote:
On Sun, 5 Dec 2004 12:05:16 -0800, don groves <dgroves@domain.net
wrote:
In article <31h4toF3c3a07U1@individual.net>, Jess Askin at
dontbother@nospam.net exposited:
"irwell" <hook@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:oje4r0tt5a30i5a58a96cbg3esdrd1hdci@4ax.com...
The French seem to use Senatrice.
I believe Hillary Clinton prefers Senatrix.
Will she become the party whip?
Would Hillary tie our hands? She is the one who needs to be
restrained, ya know, or else the Democratic candidate for president in
2008, if she's to be that, will lose bigger time than the one in 2004
did, I predict.
Depends a lot on what happens under the Bush
second term, an Iraq disater or even worse.
No, no, I wasn't saying a Democrat couldn't win, I was saying Hillary
couldn't. American men wouldn't tolerate a Maggie, as their British
cousins did for a while. That returns us to Don's comment, since
dominatrixs handy with the whip were popularized by the English. That
style of sadomasochistic behavior is termed "English culture", or
something much like it, for that reason.
|
As long as it isn't French, Bob's her uncle.
--
dg (domain=ccwebster) |
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