| Author |
Message |
Ralf Reddi
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:55 am
Post subject: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
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|
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last music
lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been convinced,
that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport like a trolley
bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly live]
Ralf Reddi
--
reddi.de
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Harvey Van Sickle
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:34 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
| Quote: | Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last
music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been
convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to
the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport like
a trolley bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly live]
|
It's not town-specific; the teacher's right. I've not googled for the
lyrics, but "trolley" in BrEng usage generally means "shopping trolley"
-- that basket-on-wheels thingie that one uses in a supermarket.
But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used. There
was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley" (shopping +
trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
The passenger-transport vehicle known as a "trolley" was -- and in
modern times, since they've been re-introduced, is -- known here as a
"tram", not a "trolley".
--
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 22 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van) |
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Harvey Van Sickle
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:39 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
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|
On 13 Oct 2004, Harvey Van Sickle wrote
| Quote: | On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last
music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been
convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to
the jeweler's store.
|
-snip-
| Quote: | But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used.
There was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley"
(shopping + trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
|
Ah: they still do them: top hit on google for "Sholley" is
http://www.sholley.com/
This is -- I think you can be certain -- is what Desmond took to the
jeweller's shop.
--
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 22 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van)
|
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Don Phillipson
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:45 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
"Ralf Reddi" <t.taelle@kytelis.de> wrote in message
news:2t5fgsF1s8ie5U1@uni-berlin.de...
| Quote: | Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last music
lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been convinced,
that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport like a
trolley
bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
|
Trolley-buses were used in many British cities
40 years ago when the Beatles wrote this song.
They ran on rubber wheels, powered by electricity
from overhead wires via a trolley that rolled along
the wires.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada) |
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|
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raymond o'hara
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:51 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
"Harvey Van Sickle" <harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9581DB630E555whhvans@194.168.222.124...
| Quote: | On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last
music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been
convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to
the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport like
a trolley bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly live]
It's not town-specific; the teacher's right. I've not googled for the
lyrics, but "trolley" in BrEng usage generally means "shopping trolley"
-- that basket-on-wheels thingie that one uses in a supermarket.
But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used. There
was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley" (shopping +
trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
The passenger-transport vehicle known as a "trolley" was -- and in
modern times, since they've been re-introduced, is -- known here as a
"tram", not a "trolley".
|
Unless one is very very rich it is rare to go shopping at the jewelry store
with a shopping cart, I'd venture he took public transport to the store. |
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Robt Englund
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:52 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
In article <2t5fgsF1s8ie5U1@uni-berlin.de>, t.taelle@kytelis.de says...
| Quote: | Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last music
lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been convinced
|
Hmm. I'm assuming your son's class didn't discuss the rest of the verse:
"And as he gives it to her she begins to sing."
BTW, Sting, in his live cover of the song, puts more nudge-nudge-wink-
wink into that line than you'd think possible.
RobertE |
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Harvey Van Sickle
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 3:28 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On 13 Oct 2004, raymond o'hara wrote
| Quote: |
"Harvey Van Sickle" <harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9581DB630E555whhvans@194.168.222.124...
On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the
last music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been
convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to
the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport
like a trolley bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly
live]
It's not town-specific; the teacher's right. I've not googled
for the lyrics, but "trolley" in BrEng usage generally means
"shopping trolley" -- that basket-on-wheels thingie that one uses
in a supermarket.
But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used.
There was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley"
(shopping + trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
The passenger-transport vehicle known as a "trolley" was -- and
in modern times, since they've been re-introduced, is -- known
here as a "tram", not a "trolley".
Unless one is very very rich it is rare to go shopping at the
jewelry store
with a shopping cart,
|
I think that's probably the point, innit?
| Quote: | I'd venture he took public transport to the
store.
|
That must inevitably mean that someone born c.1940 in the north of
England, writing a song in the 1960s, was using "trolley" to mean some
sort of public transport.
That strikes me as very odd.
--
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 22 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van) |
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| Back to top |
|
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Robin Bignall
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 3:54 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 21:28:33 GMT, Harvey Van Sickle
<harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On 13 Oct 2004, raymond o'hara wrote
"Harvey Van Sickle" <harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9581DB630E555whhvans@194.168.222.124...
On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the
last music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been
convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to
the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport
like a trolley bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly
live]
It's not town-specific; the teacher's right. I've not googled
for the lyrics, but "trolley" in BrEng usage generally means
"shopping trolley" -- that basket-on-wheels thingie that one uses
in a supermarket.
But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used.
There was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley"
(shopping + trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
The passenger-transport vehicle known as a "trolley" was -- and
in modern times, since they've been re-introduced, is -- known
here as a "tram", not a "trolley".
Unless one is very very rich it is rare to go shopping at the
jewelry store
with a shopping cart,
I think that's probably the point, innit?
I'd venture he took public transport to the
store.
That must inevitably mean that someone born c.1940 in the north of
England, writing a song in the 1960s, was using "trolley" to mean some
sort of public transport.
That strikes me as very odd.
|
Nota tall, Harvey. Many northern towns had trolley buses in the 1940s.
Maybe the Beatles grew up with them, as I did.
However, the lyrics are:
"Desmond takes a trolly to the jewellers stores
Buys a twenty carat golden ring
Takes it back to Molly waiting at the door
And as he gives it to her she begins to sing."
http://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Beatles/Obladi-Oblada.html
That 'trolly' may be a typo, of course. But taking a shopping trolley
to a jeweller's store for a ring seems to be as silly a joke as
Desmond becoming a she in the final verse, so you could be right.
"Happy ever after in the market place
Molly lets the children lend a hand
Desmond stays at home and does his pretty face
And in the evening she's a singer with the band."
--
wrmst rgrds
Robin Bignall
Hertfordshire
England |
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|
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Harvey Van Sickle
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:03 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On 13 Oct 2004, Robin Bignall wrote
| Quote: | On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 21:28:33 GMT, Harvey Van Sickle
harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
On 13 Oct 2004, raymond o'hara wrote
"Harvey Van Sickle" <harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9581DB630E555whhvans@194.168.222.124...
On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the
last music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had
been convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with
wheels] to the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport
like a trolley bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly
live]
It's not town-specific; the teacher's right. I've not googled
for the lyrics, but "trolley" in BrEng usage generally means
"shopping trolley" -- that basket-on-wheels thingie that one
uses in a supermarket.
But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used.
There was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley"
(shopping + trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
The passenger-transport vehicle known as a "trolley" was -- and
in modern times, since they've been re-introduced, is -- known
here as a "tram", not a "trolley".
Unless one is very very rich it is rare to go shopping at the
jewelry store
with a shopping cart,
I think that's probably the point, innit?
I'd venture he took public transport to the
store.
That must inevitably mean that someone born c.1940 in the north
of England, writing a song in the 1960s, was using "trolley" to
mean some sort of public transport.
That strikes me as very odd.
Nota tall, Harvey. Many northern towns had trolley buses in the
1940s. Maybe the Beatles grew up with them, as I did.
However, the lyrics are:
"Desmond takes a trolly to the jewellers stores
Buys a twenty carat golden ring
Takes it back to Molly waiting at the door
And as he gives it to her she begins to sing.
http://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Beatles/Obladi-Oblada.html
That 'trolly' may be a typo, of course. But taking a shopping
trolley to a jeweller's store for a ring seems to be as silly a
joke as Desmond becoming a she in the final verse, so you could be
right.
"Happy ever after in the market place
Molly lets the children lend a hand
Desmond stays at home and does his pretty face
And in the evening she's a singer with the band."
|
Fairy nuff; surreal stuff, p'raps.
But I've only ever come across the unqualified "trolley" on this side
of t'ocean to mean "shopping trolley" -- I've heard "trolley bus", but
as far as I can recall that invariably included the "bus" qualifier.
Was "trolley" generally used in England as a short form for "trolley
bus"? (I don't think I've ever come across it -- at least in southern
England -- since I moved here in the early 1980s, but both trolley
buses and trams had long been phased out by then.)
--
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 22 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van) |
|
| Back to top |
|
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Peter Duncanson
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:13 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 22:03:18 GMT, Harvey Van Sickle
<harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Was "trolley" generally used in England as a short form for "trolley
bus"? (I don't think I've ever come across it -- at least in southern
England -- since I moved here in the early 1980s, but both trolley
buses and trams had long been phased out by then.)
In my experience in Manchester in 1959 - 1960s the vehicle was always a |
"trolley bus".
For clarification: a trolley bus was a bus with an electric motor that
collected power from overhead wires. It had wheels and steering like any
other bus. It did not run on a track.
--
Peter Duncanson
UK (posting from a.e.u) |
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| Back to top |
|
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Harvey Van Sickle
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:18 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On 13 Oct 2004, Peter Duncanson wrote
| Quote: | On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 22:03:18 GMT, Harvey Van Sickle
harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
Was "trolley" generally used in England as a short form for
"trolley bus"? (I don't think I've ever come across it -- at
least in southern England -- since I moved here in the early
1980s, but both trolley buses and trams had long been phased out
by then.)
In my experience in Manchester in 1959 - 1960s the vehicle was
always a "trolley bus".
For clarification: a trolley bus was a bus with an electric motor
that collected power from overhead wires. It had wheels and
steering like any other bus. It did not run on a track.
|
Yes, that's what I'm thinking of: if it ran on tracks, it was a tram.
(The careful addition of "bus" to "trolley" was a pondial difference
which I noted when I moved here. Where I grew up -- Ottawa -- I think
we called our trolley buses "trolleys". Trams had disappeared by the
time I became of aware of such things, but of course if they *had*
existed, I'd have called them "street cars".)
--
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 22 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van) |
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| Back to top |
|
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Robin Bignall
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:27 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 22:03:18 GMT, Harvey Van Sickle
<harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Was "trolley" generally used in England as a short form for "trolley
bus"? (I don't think I've ever come across it -- at least in southern
England -- since I moved here in the early 1980s, but both trolley
buses and trams had long been phased out by then.)
|
It was within my immediate neighbourhood when I was a kid. The road I
was born on was halfway up a hill. One walked down the hill to catch
the trolley, up the hill to catch the (diesel) bus. The trolley was
preferred, not just because it was quieter, but also because the local
stop was a terminus, and a trolley would usually be waiting, and not
set out until the next one arrived. Very handy in cold or wet weather,
for bus shelters hadn't been thought necessary in those days.
Trolley buses in Nottingham started to be used in 1926, and began to
be phased out in the 1950s, my local route being one of the first to
be replaced by diesel buses. The last one ran in 1966.
--
wrmst rgrds
Robin Bignall
Hertfordshire
England |
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| Back to top |
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John Dean
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:40 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
Harvey Van Sickle wrote:
| Quote: | On 13 Oct 2004, Robin Bignall wrote
On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 21:28:33 GMT, Harvey Van Sickle
harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
On 13 Oct 2004, raymond o'hara wrote
"Harvey Van Sickle" <harvey.news@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9581DB630E555whhvans@194.168.222.124...
On 13 Oct 2004, Ralf Reddi wrote
Hi!
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the
last music lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had
been convinced, that Desmond took a [shopping basket with
wheels] to the jeweler's store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport
like a trolley bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
[Is something known about the town, where Desmond and Molly
live]
It's not town-specific; the teacher's right. I've not googled
for the lyrics, but "trolley" in BrEng usage generally means
"shopping trolley" -- that basket-on-wheels thingie that one
uses in a supermarket.
But it also means a sort of suitcase-on-wheels used (mainly) by
pensioners, which I suspect is the version that Desmond used.
There was a commercial brand of these known as a "Sholley"
(shopping + trolley) -- they may still be sold under that name.
The passenger-transport vehicle known as a "trolley" was -- and
in modern times, since they've been re-introduced, is -- known
here as a "tram", not a "trolley".
Unless one is very very rich it is rare to go shopping at the
jewelry store
with a shopping cart,
I think that's probably the point, innit?
I'd venture he took public transport to the
store.
That must inevitably mean that someone born c.1940 in the north
of England, writing a song in the 1960s, was using "trolley" to
mean some sort of public transport.
That strikes me as very odd.
Nota tall, Harvey. Many northern towns had trolley buses in the
1940s. Maybe the Beatles grew up with them, as I did.
However, the lyrics are:
"Desmond takes a trolly to the jewellers stores
Buys a twenty carat golden ring
Takes it back to Molly waiting at the door
And as he gives it to her she begins to sing.
http://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Beatles/Obladi-Oblada.html
That 'trolly' may be a typo, of course. But taking a shopping
trolley to a jeweller's store for a ring seems to be as silly a
joke as Desmond becoming a she in the final verse, so you could be
right.
"Happy ever after in the market place
Molly lets the children lend a hand
Desmond stays at home and does his pretty face
And in the evening she's a singer with the band."
Fairy nuff; surreal stuff, p'raps.
But I've only ever come across the unqualified "trolley" on this side
of t'ocean to mean "shopping trolley" -- I've heard "trolley bus", but
as far as I can recall that invariably included the "bus" qualifier.
Was "trolley" generally used in England as a short form for "trolley
bus"? (I don't think I've ever come across it -- at least in southern
England -- since I moved here in the early 1980s, but both trolley
buses and trams had long been phased out by then.)
|
One version of 'trolley', of course, is a kind of barrow. So Desmond
might have been pushing his own barrow (which he daren't leave
unattended) and Paul wanted to use enriched vocabulary. Or it could
indeed have been a shopping trolley. Or it could have been a trolley
bus, though like most correspondents here, I don't recollect 'trolley'
as a standaloner for 'trolley bus'. Mind you, Paul always was a fan of
musicals and, like the rest of us, will have heard Judy on TV singing
'Clang clang clang went the trolley' often enough as a kid for the iron
to have entered his soul.
And anyway, the Beatles were fans of American culture and music long
before they ever got the chance to go there, so there's no reason to
dismiss the idea they might have thrown a little US vocab into their
song-writing. Doubly so after they'd actually been there.
But Liverpool was more of a tram city - 'No Trams to Lime Street' being
that city's tribute to 'A Streetcar named Desire'
--
John Dean
Oxford |
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| Back to top |
|
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Ralf Reddi
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:47 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
Thank you everybody
I had been afraid that you native speaker would laugh at me and find an
unambiguous answer from scratch.
I'm relieved to see, that my question was not that selfevident.
Ralf Reddi
Hamburg
--
reddi.de |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
raymond o'hara
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 7:45 am
Post subject: Re: Desmond takes a TROLLEY to the jeweler's store |
|
|
"Don Phillipson" <d.phillipson@ttrryytteell.com> wrote in message
news:A8ibd.3332$Cb5.25157@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
| Quote: | "Ralf Reddi" <t.taelle@kytelis.de> wrote in message
news:2t5fgsF1s8ie5U1@uni-berlin.de...
Recently my son came home from school and told sth about the last music
lesson.
Subject had been 'Obladi Oblada' and the music teacher had been
convinced,
that Desmond took a [shopping basket with wheels] to the jeweler's
store.
I'd rather believe, he used some vehicle of public transport like a
trolley
bus or Straßenbahn, tramway.
Trolley-buses were used in many British cities
40 years ago when the Beatles wrote this song.
They ran on rubber wheels, powered by electricity
from overhead wires via a trolley that rolled along
the wires.
|
In Massachusetts we called those type trackless trolleys. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| |
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