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Rifleman
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 3:37 am
Post subject: A proverb needs your explanation |
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[ That's just one more straw his camel didn't need. ]
Is there anyone that has ever heard the above saying or any similar one?
What does it mean? What proper situation should I use it?
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Dr Robin Bignall
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:06 am
Post subject: Re: A proverb needs your explanation |
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On Wed, 8 Sep 2004 06:37:53 +0900, "Rifleman" <tellmewhatever@hotmail.com>
wrote:
| Quote: |
[ That's just one more straw his camel didn't need. ]
Is there anyone that has ever heard the above saying or any similar one?
What does it mean? What proper situation should I use it?
In Britain it's usually stated as "That's the last straw...", an |
abbreviation of "That's the last straw that broke the camel's back". Its
origin is supposed to be that one can keep on putting loads onto a camel's
back and, instead of gradually bending under the load, the camel appears to
suffer without complaint until the last, tiny additional weight (a straw),
in which case it suddenly collapses. Whether camels do actually collapse
like that is left as an exercise for the reader and his weights, but that's
the theory.
In practice it means that a person can get very annoyed about a situation
but still keep his cool, until one, final, and often quite small, event
pulls his trigger or acts as a catalyst, and the person's control goes.
--
wrmst rgrds
Robin Bignall
Quiet part of Hertfordshire
England |
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Rifleman
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:56 am
Post subject: Re: A proverb needs your explanation |
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"Dr Robin Bignall" <docrobin@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:cjbsj0dk78jkpfnc65cn9rkauojhrfqmav@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Wed, 8 Sep 2004 06:37:53 +0900, "Rifleman" <tellmewhatever@hotmail.com
wrote:
[ That's just one more straw his camel didn't need. ]
Is there anyone that has ever heard the above saying or any similar one?
What does it mean? What proper situation should I use it?
In Britain it's usually stated as "That's the last straw...", an
abbreviation of "That's the last straw that broke the camel's back". Its
origin is supposed to be that one can keep on putting loads onto a camel's
back and, instead of gradually bending under the load, the camel appears
to
suffer without complaint until the last, tiny additional weight (a straw),
in which case it suddenly collapses. Whether camels do actually collapse
like that is left as an exercise for the reader and his weights, but
that's
the theory.
In practice it means that a person can get very annoyed about a situation
but still keep his cool, until one, final, and often quite small, event
pulls his trigger or acts as a catalyst, and the person's control goes.
--
wrmst rgrds
Robin Bignall
Quiet part of Hertfordshire
England
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Thank you Dr. Bignall for the quick reply. I couldn't grasp the meaning
from the context and now it's clear. Thanks.
Rifleman
Corea
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John Dean
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 6:05 am
Post subject: Re: A proverb needs your explanation |
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Dr Robin Bignall wrote:
| Quote: | On Wed, 8 Sep 2004 06:37:53 +0900, "Rifleman"
tellmewhatever@hotmail.com> wrote:
[ That's just one more straw his camel didn't need. ]
Is there anyone that has ever heard the above saying or any similar
one? What does it mean? What proper situation should I use it?
In Britain it's usually stated as "That's the last straw...", an
abbreviation of "That's the last straw that broke the camel's back".
Its origin is supposed to be that one can keep on putting loads onto
a camel's back and, instead of gradually bending under the load, the
camel appears to suffer without complaint until the last, tiny
additional weight (a straw), in which case it suddenly collapses.
Whether camels do actually collapse like that is left as an exercise
for the reader and his weights, but that's the theory.
That's how it seemed to work in the Olympics in the Throwing the Weight |
on the Floor event. Nobody was able to throw down the weighted bar until
that last few ounces was added and then they were able to hurl it down
with vigour.
--
John Dean
Oxford |
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meirman
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:24 am
Post subject: Re: A proverb needs your explanation |
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In alt.english.usage on Wed, 8 Sep 2004 06:37:53 +0900 "Rifleman"
<tellmewhatever@hotmail.com> posted:
| Quote: | Subject: A proverb needs your explanation
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We all have needs, but I didn't think proverbs usually did.
| Quote: |
[ That's just one more straw his camel didn't need. ]
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I'm thinking maybe a proverb would be phrased, "Every camel has a
limit to the amount of straw it needs" or "Do not give your camel too
many straws."
| Quote: | Is there anyone that has ever heard the above saying or any similar one?
What does it mean? What proper situation should I use it?
|
That's the straw that broke the camel's back. I'd say it's a popular
expression, and useful when used where the situation fits the meaning
of the sentence. But I don't think it's a proverb.
Donkeys, at least, are great pack animals, and can carry an enormous
amount for their size, but if you put on one more thing than their
limit, whatever that is, they will sit down, bending all four legs,
and won't move at all until you take something off.
I think camels are the same way. Usually people aren't putting on
single straws, but once you know a camel, it's pretty clear that one
could do it that way. If a twenty pound box is what makes him sit
down, then somewhere in the middle of 20 pounds of straw, one straw
will be too many.
I don't think it really break their backs, but somehow that's the
expression. I suspect instead of putting a straw on, someone once put
an added 80 pound item on and really did break the camel's back,
before he had a chance to sit down. Or maybe in some other language,
break one's back is a standard idiom for this. We use it English to
mean "work very hard and get very tired."
I agree with Robin that "That's the last straw" often, maybe all the
time, refers to the last annoyance before someone gets angry.
But That's the straw that broke the camel's back, I think, refers more
generally to all and various kinds of overloading.
It's sort of strange that the longer sentence should be more general
than the shorter one.
s/ meirman If you are emailing me please
say if you are posting the same response.
Born west of Pittsburgh Pa. 10 years
Indianapolis, 7 years
Chicago, 6 years
Brooklyn NY 12 years
Baltimore 20 years |
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Christopher Green
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| Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 3:00 am
Post subject: Re: A proverb needs your explanation |
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meirman <meirman@invalid.com> wrote in message news:<hvmsj0tgk12gerqgoak81k9b1jv6png1p8@4ax.com>...
| Quote: | In alt.english.usage on Wed, 8 Sep 2004 06:37:53 +0900 "Rifleman"
tellmewhatever@hotmail.com> posted:
Subject: A proverb needs your explanation
We all have needs, but I didn't think proverbs usually did.
[ That's just one more straw his camel didn't need. ]
I'm thinking maybe a proverb would be phrased, "Every camel has a
limit to the amount of straw it needs" or "Do not give your camel too
many straws."
Is there anyone that has ever heard the above saying or any similar one?
What does it mean? What proper situation should I use it?
That's the straw that broke the camel's back. I'd say it's a popular
expression, and useful when used where the situation fits the meaning
of the sentence. But I don't think it's a proverb.
|
There is something of a consensus that the straw-and-camel version
made its print debut in "Dombey and Son" (1848), "As the last straw
breaks the laden camel's back, this piece of underground information
crushed the sinking spirits of Mr. Dombey."
A related feather-and-horse version did appear in 1655: "It is the
last feather may be said to break an Horses back." (Bramhall, "Defence
of True Liberty of Human Actions").
It sounds more like both Dickens and Bramhall were using phrases they
already knew to be current rather than inventing them for the purpose.
--
Chris Green |
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