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M. Ranjit Mathews
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:01 pm
Post subject: adverb or adjective? |
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A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
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Ron Hardin
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:01 pm
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
| Quote: |
A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
|
It's parasitic on ``spicy hotness or a hot hotness?''
A food that has spicy hotness is spicy hot.
So I'd say compound adjective, by analogy with compound noun.
Incidentally the first ``hot'' in ``hot hot'' is narrower than
the second : ``hot properly so called'' and ``hot in general,''
respectively.
--
Ron Hardin
rhhardin@mindspring.com
On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk. |
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Freddy
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:01 pm
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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"M. Ranjit Mathews" <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1d4c67e3.0411161140.5b0e667d@posting.google.com...
| Quote: | A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
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Wot?
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R H Draney
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:00 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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Ron Hardin filted:
| Quote: |
M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
It's parasitic on ``spicy hotness or a hot hotness?''
A food that has spicy hotness is spicy hot.
So I'd say compound adjective, by analogy with compound noun.
|
I think it's more a matter of amplification...the word "hot" means more than one
thing, so the speaker qualifies which is meant: "'spicy' hot or 'hot' hot"....
Cf "funny 'strange' or funny 'ha-ha'?"....
| Quote: | Incidentally the first ``hot'' in ``hot hot'' is narrower than
the second : ``hot properly so called'' and ``hot in general,''
respectively.
|
"Hot qua hot"?...r |
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Ron Hardin
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:01 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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Peter T. Daniels wrote:
| Quote: | A food that has spicy hotness is spicy hot.
Do you fail to notice that "hot" is the base and "hotness" a (fairly
rare) derivative of it? (The usual nominalization of "hot" is "heat.")
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So spices produce heat? I hadn't heard that usage. I've heard plenty about
spices producing hotness.
Moreover that's technically correct. Hotness is the ratio of the increase in heat
to the increase in entropy.
So you see that heat is pretty far down the food chain from hotness.
Nobody mentions entropy and spices.
--
Ron Hardin
rhhardin@mindspring.com
On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk. |
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Peter T. Daniels
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:01 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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Ron Hardin wrote:
| Quote: |
M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
It's parasitic on ``spicy hotness or a hot hotness?''
|
Pay no attention to the dyslexic behind the curtain.
| Quote: | A food that has spicy hotness is spicy hot.
|
Do you fail to notice that "hot" is the base and "hotness" a (fairly
rare) derivative of it? (The usual nominalization of "hot" is "heat.")
| Quote: | So I'd say compound adjective, by analogy with compound noun.
Incidentally the first ``hot'' in ``hot hot'' is narrower than
the second : ``hot properly so called'' and ``hot in general,''
respectively.
On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk.
-- |
Peter T. Daniels grammatim@att.net |
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Raymond S. Wise
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:03 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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"M. Ranjit Mathews" <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1d4c67e3.0411161140.5b0e667d@posting.google.com...
| Quote: | A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
|
Take a look at *Contrastive Focus Reduplication in English (The Salad-Salad
Paper)*:
in .DOC form at
people.brandeis.edu/~jackendo/redup10g.doc
or
in .HTML form at
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:ASMtqsmiYoAJ:people.brandeis.edu/~jackendo/redup10g.doc+%22The+SALAD-salad+Paper%22&hl=en
or
http://tinyurl.com/4kexw
--
Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com |
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Glenn Knickerbocker
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 10:03 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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On 16 Nov 2004 11:40:10 -0800, M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
| Quote: | Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
|
I'd spell them with hyphens and call them compounds.
The Kaibo National Forest is in the Big Rock Candy Mountains.
¬R http://users.bestweb.net/~notr/arkville.html --red |
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Ben Zimmer
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 10:03 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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"Raymond S. Wise" wrote:
There's also a corpus of examples at:
http://www.umanitoba.ca/linguistics/russell/redup-corpus.html
The corpus includes one example of "hot hot", but not as a contrast to
"spicy hot":
You like it HOT-hot, eh? You like it really hot?
[talking about the weather] |
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Jacques Guy
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 10:03 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
| Quote: | A: "This food is hot!"
B: Is the food spicy hot or hot hot?
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
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Neither. They just don't quite fit the Procrustean bed
of grammarians, that's all. |
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Peter T. Daniels
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:01 pm
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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Ben Zimmer wrote:
That doesn't seem to be the same usage at all.
What are the dates of these sources? Nancy Dray studied what she called
doubles for her M.A. thesis at Chicago about 20 years ago.
--
Peter T. Daniels grammatim@att.net |
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Ben Zimmer
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:03 pm
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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"Peter T. Daniels" wrote:
The paper (published this year in _Natural Language and Linguistic
Theory_, Vol. 22) says the corpus was "gathered from natural speech,
written texts, and television scripts", so presumably the authors (Jila
Ghomeshi, Ray Jackendoff, Nicole Rosen, and Kevin Russell) have been
collecting the examples for some years. There are 177 examples in all
-- none of the ones from natural speech are dated, but the examples from
textual and mass-media sources range from 1992 to 2003.
| Quote: | Nancy Dray studied what she called
doubles for her M.A. thesis at Chicago about 20 years ago.
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They do cite Dray's thesis ("Doubles and Modifiers in English", 1987). |
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R H Draney
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:03 pm
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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Ben Zimmer filted:
| Quote: |
The corpus includes one example of "hot hot", but not as a contrast to
"spicy hot":
You like it HOT-hot, eh? You like it really hot?
[talking about the weather]
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Get thee behind me, Buster Poindexter!...r |
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Ben Zimmer
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:04 pm
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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R H Draney wrote:
| Quote: |
Ben Zimmer filted:
The corpus includes one example of "hot hot", but not as a contrast to
"spicy hot":
You like it HOT-hot, eh? You like it really hot?
[talking about the weather]
Get thee behind me, Buster Poindexter!...r
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There's also a popular indie-rock band out of Vancouver called "Hot Hot
Heat"... |
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Bill Bonde ( ``And the La
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:33 am
Post subject: Re: adverb or adjective? |
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Glenn Knickerbocker wrote:
| Quote: |
On 16 Nov 2004 11:40:10 -0800, M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
Are spicy and the first hot in "hot hot" used as adverbs since they
imply "spicily hot" and "hotly hot" or are "spicy hot" and "hot hot"
compound adjectives that specialize hot into a spicy kind of hot and a
hot kind of hot?
I'd spell them with hyphens and call them compounds.
If English were a language where adjectives took changeable endings |
while compound nouns didn't, we could easily tell what was going on.
--
I heard Clinton buried a time capsule at his new presidential library
sized like an overseas shipping container filled with stuff he didn't
want anyone to find till long after his death, the real deed to
Whitewater, the envelope for the Tyson Foods chicken payoffs, the real
gun he used to whack Foster, the keys to the Exocet missile he took Ron
Brown out with, copies of another few thousand illegally acquired FBI
files on his enemies, tickets to Tahiti from the White House Travel
Office, a few more soiled dresses, a couple of cases of well chewed
Cuban cigars, and the unabridged version of his autobiography. That last
one was touch and go just getting the bugger in. |
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